➡ The speaker, who once worked at Lockheed and had access to top-secret documents, studied data from Voyager 1 and Voyager 2 and discovered strange activities in the rings of Saturn. He believes these activities are caused by unidentified crafts, which he calls “ringmakers”, that are also now appearing around Uranus and Jupiter. He suggests these crafts are creating the rings around these planets, possibly as a form of exhaust. The speaker also hints at a potential threat if these crafts come to Earth, emphasizing the need for more research into this phenomenon.
➡ The speaker discusses their belief that new rings around planets like Uranus and Jupiter are not naturally occurring, but are created by unidentified entities using the rings’ energy to power their crafts. They also suggest that NASA may be withholding information from the public about these phenomena. The speaker also mentions their work in a defense industry company, where they felt their colleagues were not capable of the same research. Lastly, they mention obtaining a law degree to better understand the legal aspects of their work.

And I had Voyager 1 and Voyager 2 data, and that I inspected and studied for quite a while. And that’s when I wrote the first book, and I was so surprised at what I found that it took me, like, the four years to get the book published, because I wasn’t sure that what I had was really right. And so I looked in many articles and books, and you see, oh yeah, this sort of fits what they’re talking about there. Okay, you’re okay, so publish it. And so the book came out in 1985. Okay, and that’s The Ringmakers.

That’s The Ringmakers. But the other one, this one… That’s 1971. I had left Lockheed. Uh-huh. Well, did we build it? Pardon? Did we build it? Who built it? The craft. I don’t know who built it, but what I found out is these things inhabit Saturn. That’s where I first discovered them, and they’re proliferating. They’re now Uranus and Jupiter. Wherever you see some rings now, that’s one of these… You see the craft? Yeah, I call it a ringmaker. Okay, you call it a ringmaker. Yeah, and I can say it’s electromagnetic, because I can identify streamline patterns with respect to it that I knew were what we call potential lines, and that says it was electrical.

When I worked at Lockheed, I had documents that were indeed top secret. Really? Wow. Oh, yeah. And then I went through the first generation of the Polaris Underwater launch vehicle, and then I got tapped to go behind closed doors. Oh, you did? Yeah, and I was there until I got claustrophobia. Three doors to get to you? Yeah, I had to sign my life away for 30 years. Wow. Is it still in effect right now? No. No? So could you tell me anything? No. You can’t? Why? What would happen? I’d prefer not to find out.

I might have seen some craft in those hangars. Is that right? It was my first clue that there was something in space that was different. I was handed one day a set of data. The guy that gave it to me said, nobody else around here has ever been able to get anything out of these data, and if anybody can, you can. And so I went through it, and I found this one spot of data that really looked interesting. And I slugged through, plotting it up. It was quite a difficult task to draw the picture of that.

And when I got it, you could tell it was something strange. At that time, I have seen one on the ground in Antarctica. You have? Not personally, but an image of one, which I wish I had it cut out on. These things could come in real low. They’re all sizes. It’s the same deal as airplanes, you know, they’re cubs. Right. And so when you’re talking about the craft in the rings of Saturn, you’re talking about something huge, right? Much bigger than we could even conceive of, I understand. I don’t know, was it 70,000? Yes.

In looking down on the rings, I could see parallel lines crossing all the rings at once. That’s about as long as you can get them. That’s incredible. But I could tell that those lines demarked the outside of an object. Are you sort of saying, when you say you got claustrophobia, I don’t know what that means. Do you mean that you became sort of tired of working in this above-top secret area? No, I’m not tired, and it was very exciting. I got to see everything that went on all over the world. Wow. Nothing much has changed.

I don’t know. Were you threatened? What did you have friends who were leaving the employee of Lockheed at that time, and was there some incident that happened that made you want to leave? No, it wasn’t that. Let’s just say that you’re confined to one room day after day, year after year, same walls, so forth. That’s claustrophobia. I see. But I knew that there was something going on out there, and see if you can’t find it. Okay, but have you heard that NASA alters their footage coming from the moon, et cetera? I know some of the things they do with it, yeah.

Okay, so even their footage is not always dependable, right? Although, I guess it’s dependable to begin with. It’s just that they start altering it later. I have been told by a very reliable source. He asked me what camera did I get that image from on the moon. I said, half the blood, and he said, that’s right. He says, I thought we darkened that enough. Did you even find it? Oh, yes, so you were finding things that they didn’t, they thought they covered up. Incredible. Yeah, yeah. That must have been a lot of fun. And this guy says, well, I suppose you want me to go out and tell everybody about that.

I said, no, I don’t want to embarrass you. That doesn’t make any difference to me. Whatever you want to do is fine with me. I’m just saying, I found what you saw. Then we’re able to, you know, sort of look at and keep in sort of pristine condition? I’ll tell you, at this juncture, I don’t know what I have. I finally went to put it in a vault that the people claimed nobody can get in here, including the government. But unfortunately, somehow, somebody did. Oh, really? Yeah. And what they do, like I have someone on a laptop, someone who’s just on discs and so forth, they garble it.

They run it through something, and they garble it. So it’s no longer— And sometimes there’s just nothing on there. And I know that there should be something, and there’s nothing. So I don’t know how much of the early stuff I can put together. What I do know is I can put together at any time. Just because of— I don’t need that old stuff you can tell people. Really? I don’t need it. Because you know you’re familiar with the landscapes. You know where things are. You know where I’m familiar with on that state. I know pretty much what’s going on.

It’s sort of simple. On the— And that’s a lot of energy. Right. And— And this is the ring, right? This part, this is the ring? That ends up being the ring. It’s a plasma. Oh, really? So what your theory is they’re manufacturing it. Is that correct? It comes from—that’s the exhaust from this thing. From the craft? Yes. Is it because— are they stationary or are they moving the craft? They’re coming moving. So do you think—when you say things are getting critical, are you saying— Okay, just take that picture and say that’s the exhaust.

It’s like you have an air cleaner exhaust. It’s in your atmosphere. And it can load a lot of energy, you know. And—but this is— Saturn, like John Lear says, you know, Saturn is the focal point. And I can’t agree with him more. Okay, but John Lear talks about Saturn actually being portal into another dimension. Well, you know, I—he’s theorizing. Yeah, so you don’t necessarily go there. I don’t go that way. I either say this is the way it is or I can’t tap it. Okay, but you’re saying things are getting critical because I’m really curious.

Are you saying that those craft are coming here? Is that why it’s critical? No, I’m saying in effect if they do— and there’s a good probability that that is possible, then hey, you’ve got to get with it. You can’t wait around. Okay, but you see, no one really in this country accepts the concept that that’s Saturn. Those things are there. Right. And you can’t do it at Saturn or else, you know, you just can’t find it. It feels got to be made to understand that those things are real. You know there’s a movie out called Prometheus, right? I can’t see what I do.

You don’t know that. Well, there is one. And I talked to Richard Hoagland. He said Prometheus is—well, first of all, there’s a moon in Saturn called Prometheus, right? Yeah. And I’m told that there’s some kind of interaction between that moon and the rings. Well, sure. There’s no question about it. Okay. Yeah, I would agree with him. And there’s some—and you say there’s something going on now. It’s becoming critical is how you’re terming it. Yeah, it’s much more prevalent than what we saw in 1985 or earlier. Meaning there’s more activity on Saturn, do you think? Or just more activity around this question about the rings and the craft and the rings? No, there’s actual activity.

There is. You know, to start off with, Uranus, which is one of the other planets, did not have rings. That’s right. But now it does. Right. See? And so that kind of thing is going on. And we really ought to get to the root of it. Okay. Do you have a theory on why Uranus suddenly has rings? Well, sure. It’s the exhaust just like—so that’s how I think the attention is being obtained. And so I would expect something to happen. You would? Yes. When you say something to happen, what are you suggesting? I’m suggesting that Stanford, let’s say—well, let’s look into what dorms do.

As far as my own professional organization is concerned, it does not fit at all with their objectives. How is it different? It’s too controversial. Your theories, you mean? This is not a theory when there’s data. If I propose something, that is a theory. Okay, so your data or your conclusions? Yes, conclusions. Your conclusions are too controversial, is what you’re saying? They don’t want to get involved in that. But as you say, there are new rings around Uranus. And there’s other activity on other planets, too, isn’t there? Jupiter. In the solar system? And what’s happening with Jupiter? It’s getting rings.

It’s getting rings. Okay, and are you seeing craft there as well? Vehicles, as you call them. I haven’t identified craft, but I can tell you that where there’s rings, there are these things. So we have these ring makers, and they create tremendous energy. Can you tell us more about what you think is going on there? You’ve got any ideas along those lines? Well, let’s just take one that there was this, what do they call them? Fard-lookers or these psychologists? Oh, remote viewers. Remote viewers, right. I just did an interview with somebody down there.

Which one? I had heard that there was one that saw something out there in the rings, and they were mining the rings. That’s true, yes. Okay. I think I read her book, and she couldn’t see anything from the side, but when she looked from the top down, that’s when she saw things. I see. I happened to have been able to uncover what she saw. Really? Yeah. And what did you know? I would say, I don’t think they’re mining the rings. I think they’re nursing from the rings. Oh, in other words, you think they’re using the energy to power their craft.

Yeah. That’s where new ones are getting their energy. Oh, new vehicles are getting their energy? Yeah. You start out small, just like a baby, and they get bigger. Oh, right, because you say that you believe they’re sort of like alive. Do you believe they’re plasma vehicles, what’s called a plasma vehicle? Have you heard that terminology? Well, I’ve never heard of them called plasma vehicles, but I can understand why somebody might say that, yes. Yeah, I wouldn’t make a big deal over that. Okay, I’ve heard that the vehicles out there use, they actually fly close to the sun, and they power themselves up on the sun, and then they go back into it.

I wouldn’t be surprised, yeah. I’ve noticed some go in there, and it means that they’re capable of withstanding those high temperatures. True. Yeah, they could get pumped up really nicely. So, let me ask you, I mean, you know that NASA has been sort of a front organization. I call them a front organization for the Secret Space Program. I don’t know about being front. Well, when I say front, I mean, if you have an organization that deals with the public, interfaces with the public, and also misleads the public on certain things, by doctoring photos, by, you know, covering up certain things, by only releasing certain things, that’s a front organization, isn’t it? Okay, all right.

I guess you’re entitled to do that. Okay. So, if we were to look at the situation a little closer and find out who are the insider organizations, certainly Lockheed would qualify. Would you say that the defense industry are all in the no? No? No. Lockheed only recently has been getting images themselves, and having worked there, I don’t think there’d be anybody that would be capable of doing the kind of work I had been doing. They did come up with something that they could do. It required the services of one of the gents that knew how to program the computer.

And that was the advantage of the outfit. He said, I can, he can handle any size computer that there is. Okay, so the day came, and this fella’s the name of the company, his name was Jack, and Jack called a fella in and says, no, I’m ready for you to program. Jack, I’m going to have to think about that. Can I tell you over in the morning what my decision is? Yeah, yeah, yeah, think it over. The next day came, he says, Jack, I can’t do it. I am an aerodynamic specialist, and if I do this other, I’d ruin that.

It’s a no-go. Oh, how interesting. Yeah, that was the advantage. And you check around, and the good guys still have that attitude. Right, that they don’t want to get their hands dirty, they don’t want to be sort of tarred with the same brush, straight and narrow. Yeah, you come along and deviate of them. They can’t track it. That’s very interesting. Do you believe that we’re communicating with them? Have you had any evidence of that? Oh, no, no. We are not capable of doing that. You know, SETI has tried to communicate with extraterrestrials, and they haven’t done it yet.

They have chosen the type of entity that they want to communicate with in somebody that knows how to build radios. That constrains them in their thinking immensely. There is one flight of the Saturn where the instrument flew by the ring. And the idea was to sense the plasma in there. It had a wide frequency range, and it turned out to be plasma. And so they knew the speed, and they knew the time it took to pass the ring, and so they knew how thick it was. Now that was a plasma indicator. So it has been measured that indeed there is plasma range.

But you read also where, oh, this is a bunch of broken-up moons that got there, and there’s confusion in their storytelling. But the rings that are suddenly appearing around Uranus, these are not broken-up moons, right? You know, all I can say is, you know, the rings were there, and my interpretation is, by inference, I see the rings, so somewhere they’re immediately, and they’re never where you think they’re going to be. …of Saturn, and they’ve seen that there’s a hexagonal shape. You’ve heard of that. That seems to support your theory or your conclusions. That’s what he said.

Do you agree with that? Yeah. Any geometric form can be made. Okay. But you don’t see anything … I mean, isn’t there a significance to the hexagon in the Saturn symbology? Well, I would never expect a hexagon there, but I have never expected to see some of the other things I’ve seen either, so I did want to visit Saturn in the write-up I did, because there are some things that need to be fleshed out for people. But he told me that, as an engineer, you really ought to get law under your belt, because you know the nomenclature, and these are the guys that are running the country, basically.

And they really don’t know about some things that they should, but they just do it. And so, over a period of ten years, I got a law degree. Oh, you did? Wow. That’s incredible. On top of everything else you were doing, you got a law degree. I found that it was exactly like the process, and that’s what made it so easy to go in, otherwise I wouldn’t have done it. [tr:trw].