➡ Paranoid American, a unique comic publisher, has been exploring the world’s mysteries through their podcast since 2012. They delve into topics like secret societies, forbidden technology, and hidden symbols in pop culture. The podcast also features guests, like Adam from “Deborah Gets Red Pilled”, who share their personal journeys and perspectives. The goal is to challenge accepted perceptions of reality and bring listeners closer to the truth.
➡ The speaker discusses his journey from being interested in libertarianism and conspiracy theories to becoming an orthodox Christian and a homesteader. He shares his experiences of running a podcast where he explored various conspiracy theories and how it helped him evolve personally. He also discusses his political leanings, expressing skepticism towards the effectiveness of libertarianism and third-party politics. The speaker also emphasizes his strong stance against abortion, considering it a grave sin, and discusses the complexities of religious forgiveness.
➡ The speaker discusses their experience with a podcast they used to run, mentioning the stress and pressure they felt while conducting interviews and doing research. They also talk about their future plans, expressing interest in starting a new podcast focused on politics. The speaker also mentions their relationship with a person named Deborah, who they tried to influence politically, but didn’t succeed as much as they wanted to. Lastly, they promote a comic about Stanley Kubrick and the Apollo space missions.
➡ The text talks about people who criticize and hate, but despite this, the speaker continues to succeed and thrive. They express gratitude for their critics, suggesting that they’ve helped them in some way. The speaker also mentions that they’re doing well even without a deal, and they’re still appealing despite the criticism.
➡ In Orthodox Christianity, salvation isn’t guaranteed. It requires a life of repentance, prayer, and fasting. There’s a concept of ‘toll booths’ where you revisit past sins and how you dealt with them. There’s no clear consensus on unforgivable sins, and the idea of the ‘toll booths’ is debated within the Orthodox community.
➡ The speaker shares his journey from Roman Catholicism to atheism and finally to Orthodox Christianity. He compares the Pope to a lawyer who represents all Christian laws, and the Roman Catholic Church to a slow, antiquated legal system. He finds Mormonism more appealing due to its dynamic nature, but ultimately feels a connection to Orthodox Christianity. He emphasizes that his faith is based on personal feelings rather than theological knowledge or rules.
➡ The text discusses the speaker’s journey from podcasting to Russian Orthodoxy and homesteading. It criticizes those who exploit Christianity for financial gain and those who present themselves as authorities on Orthodoxy without proper knowledge or experience. The speaker also discusses the negative impact of such behavior on the religion’s image. The text further delves into various online communities, including Orthodox Twitter and the manosphere, and ends with a discussion on charisma and neuro-linguistic programming.
➡ The text discusses Neuro-Linguistic Programming (NLP), a method used to build rapport and influence people. It can be used for various purposes, from making oneself popular to manipulating others for personal gain. The text also mentions ‘pickup artists’ who use NLP techniques to attract others. However, these techniques can also be used unethically, such as manipulating someone’s emotional state or undermining their confidence.
➡ The text discusses the complexities of societal issues, using an example of a horse accidentally killing a shoemaker’s son, leading to a grudge and a potential monopoly in the shoe market. It also explores the hypothetical scenario of a billionaire in an anarcho-capitalist society setting his own rules, including a disturbingly low age of consent. The conversation questions the effectiveness of libertarianism in addressing such issues, suggesting that the same problems could occur in a simplified libertarian society as in our current complex system.
➡ The speaker discusses their political journey, starting from being uninformed and supporting ‘team blue’, to becoming more informed and switching to libertarianism, and then becoming apathetic about politics. They moved from the city to a farm, enjoying a simpler life and finding less importance in political debates. They also mention their experience with a local patriot group and their brief interest in the Q movement, but they never fully engaged with it. They now live a more self-sustaining lifestyle, not in preparation for any disaster, but simply for a more enjoyable life.
➡ The speaker shares his journey from being an anarcho-capitalist to becoming disillusioned with the movement. He talks about his experiences at freedom festivals and his decision to reject vaccines, which led to his discharge from the military. He also discusses his early awareness of conspiracy theories and how he felt ahead of the curve when the QAnon movement emerged. Lastly, he mentions how he found real-time information on various shootings on the Donald subreddit, which led him to view it as a reliable news source when mainstream media was too slow or censored.
➡ The speaker discusses various conspiracy theories, their belief in them, and their interest in the subject. They mention their openness to the existence of Bigfoot and their skepticism towards other theories like the existence of dinosaurs or little gray aliens. They also discuss their belief in the possibility of summoning a demon using a book from Amazon. The speaker also expresses doubt about the idea that Freemasons are running the world.

Good evening, listeners, brave navigators of the enigmatic and the concealed. Have you ever felt the pull of the unanswered, the allure of the mysteries that shroud our existence? For more than a decade, a unique comic publisher has dared to dive into these mysteries, unafraid of the secrets they might uncover. This audacious entity is paranoid American. Welcome to the mystifying universe of the paranoid american podcast. Launched in the year 2012, Paranoid American has been on a mission to decipher the encrypted secrets of our world. From the unnerving enigma of mkultra mind control, to the clandestine assemblies of secret societies, from the awe inspiring frontiers of forbidden technology, to the arcane patterns of occult symbols in our very own pop culture, they have committed to unveiling the concealed realities that lie just beneath the surface.

Join us as we navigate these intricate landscapes, decoding the hidden scripts of our society and challenging the accepted perceptions of reality. Folks, I’ve got a big problem on my hands. There’s a company called Paranoid American making all. All these funny memes and comics. Now, I’m a fair guy. I believe in free speech as long as it doesn’t cross the line. And if these AI generated memes dare to make fun of me. They’re crossing the line. This is your expedition into the realm of the extraordinary, the secret the shrouded. Come with us as we sift through the world’s grand mysteries, question the standardized narratives, and brave the cryptic labyrinth of the concealed truth.

So strap yourselves in, broaden your horizons, steal yourselves for a voyage into the enigmatic heart of the paranoid american podcast, where each story, every image, every revelation brings us one step closer to the elusive truth. All right, today we’ve got a super long overdue guest, Adam from Deborah gets red pilled. I know Adam, since I think would have been one of my first podcasts ever that you guys had me on. So I wanted to thank you for. For that, first of all. And just how the hell are you doing, bud? I’m doing well, man. I woke up a little bit under the weather today, so my voice is a little gravelly.

I might cough a little bit, but, yeah, that was awesome. Getting you on way back in the day, that was super early, and I’m not really doing my show anymore, but that was early on in our show, and I can’t remember how I found you, but somehow came across your instagram, and it was when you were just, like, posting cool, obscure books, and then you started showing the comic book stuff, and. And I reached out and got you. It was back when I had, like, one or two titles to my name, I think. So I had a bunch of others in the works, but I didn’t want to share anything, and so I came out of my shell since then.

But you were played a huge part in that, and I guess so did Deborah, by extension. And so you said you’re not really doing the show as much. Anyway, I saw you had a few released this year, but I just wanted to get a recap for anyone that wants to go back and listen to your backlog, which is one of the coolest concepts ever for any podcast, in my opinion. But it’s called Deborah gets red pilled. And it’s essentially you trying to convince your mother in law to, like, leave her her current political views or, like, adopt new ones or, like, just give me, like, the, the rundown of what the original concept was.

Yeah, the, the original concept was just, it just came out of me, um, kind of waking up around the 2016 elections and then just, uh, kind of developing a relationship with my mother in law. And she’s a super awesome lady. And I was, you know, I’m closer to her than my real mom, and I would just troll her relentlessly. She’s, she is from Marin County, California, which is the north side of the Golden Gate Bridge, really wealthy county in California. A lot of, you know, the financial execs and stuff from that work in San Francisco live there.

And, you know, she would be called, you know, they’re not like, you know, millionaire millionaire wealthy, but they’re upper, upper middle class. And, and, uh, she’d be called, you know, coastal leftist elite, you know, and just had, would just repeat CNN talking points and, and things like that. And it was just fun to, I would, I would. At the time, I was, um, I considered myself an anarcho capitalist, which is just as cringey, but I, I mean, equally. But I wouldn’t say they’re like the same, you know what I mean? Yeah, different, but just as gay.

Separate but equal. Yeah, yeah. And I would just troll her relentlessly. And then, you know, I was getting into, I was, I was figuring out about economics and things like that, and I’d been a leftist shit lib before that, too. I just wasn’t really awake to anything. Um, I had a bad drinking problem for a long time. I got sober in 2012, you know, around 2015. I was starting to wake up, but I was living in the Bay area, too, and I was still a product of that, you know, that, um, mind virus that’s there so, yeah.

Um, where did that mine virus come from? That, like, in your opinion, did it come from school? Did it come from culture? Did it come from just the rest of the city having the mind virus? Um, yeah, it’s just, uh, if you’re living, I lived in Oakland and San Francisco, and if you’re there, it’s really, really isolating if you have any sort of conservative or right wing views, and if you don’t, it’s, you’re never going to get exposed to those. So I had always kind of been, you know, a little bit more right wing, naturally, just because I was a working class guy who always went out and did construction and, and realized how bad it sucked to have to, like, pay for everybody else.

But then at the same time, I was, you know, a, what, what we would call in as just being a caught up in the spirit of the age. And so, you know, just the craziness that started around that election and having a little bit of Trump derangement syndrome at first. And then I was a big Bernie guy, and what really flipped a, the script for me was, was when he was in the primaries against Hillary Clinton, and they were doing the, he would go to a state and he would win the primary, but they would have these super delegates, is what they’d call them.

And they were like these super votes that came from, like, one person. So even though he would win the popular vote in the state, like, these people who were all members of the DNC had these super delegate positions and they would just push Hillary Clinton over the top. And I was just like, this seems real fishy. Blessed be her name. Yeah, yeah. I mean, she’s a fantastic lady. You know, I was a union member at the time, and, you know, Bernie bent the knee, kissed the ring, said we should vote for her. My union told me to vote for her.

I did it. You know, that’s how, that’s how far I’ve come. I voted for Hillary Clinton in 2016, you know, so. All right, we’re done here. I didn’t know about that. I’m sorry, audience. I didn’t know that. Going into this, I feel, yeah, so I’ve come, I’ve come a long way since then. And, yeah, I was just getting into, I heard Dave Smith on Joe Rogan early on and was like, wow, this guy’s, you know, speaking my language. And I was a fan of people, you know, taking responsibility for themselves and trying to kind of figure it out and make their own way.

And that’s kind of what libertarianism sounded like, to me at the time, I wasn’t aware of all the shady backroom dealings and the history of, like, how the party was conceived and who was in the. In the living room when they did it, but, um, it was the Koch brothers. And, uh, but the modern day libertarian party was conceived under the guise of the Koch brothers. Yeah. And, like, 1970 in some living room with the Koch brothers. Yeah. And now they have a gay race communist as their presidential candidate, so. Yeah. What’s his name? Chase Bliss.

That’s actually a name of really good Pedkar pedal company. I didn’t mean to say that. That sounds like a gay porn star. Chase Oliver, I think, is the guy’s name. Yeah, no shame. Chase bliss. Send me a free pedal. Consider this promo. Yeah. But, um, so I was like, you know, you know when you figure out, like, something new and it’s like your big new toy and you want to, like, share it with everybody? I was kind of that annoying guy, and I was doing it with Deborah and just. And I was also listening to a lot of getting it.

I got into, like, conspiracy podcasts. This is libertarianism that you were excited about? Yeah, I was super excited about, like, austrian economics and libertarianism. And then I was also excited about, like, a lot of the more weird, esoteric conspiracy stuff. So I was sharing it with Deborah and just freaking her out and catching her. And she wasn’t being, you know, philosophically consistent, which is big thing that when you first become in that mindset, you think like, oh, if I could just show these people that they’re, they’re philosophically being inconsistent, and then maybe they’ll read anatomy of the state by Murray Rothbard.

Oh, it’ll change the world. And, you know, I don’t think, you know, and so that it came from all that, we were having these big, long conversations. I was just sending her DM’s and funny Instagram posts and things like that to try to get her. And then I was like, you know, all these conspiracy podcasts are fun. I like them. But a lot of times, just a couple people in a room agreeing with each other. And I was like, what if I could just bring on some of the weirdest people in the world and. Or, you know, I was.

I think originally I had planned to just do all the research myself and present a case to her every week, a conspiracy to her every week. And then a couple weeks in, I was like, I don’t want to do all this research. So I started a lot of work, man. Yeah, I started reaching out and getting guests and, and taking her along for the ride. And we had some, some really good shows, some really bad, boring shows. You know, the whole run, we went for, you know, 210 episodes, something like that. And in the meantime, I left libertarianism.

I converted to orthodox Christianity. We left the city. I live on a farm now. I quit my extremely good paying with benefits union job, and I just homestead full time now. So it’s come a long way. I learned a lot of lessons from it. Yeah. And I’m a different guy. So as much fun and not fun as the podcast was, I think it really helped me get to where I am in my life right now. So, I mean, you said orthodox Christian, but it doesn’t sound like orthodox Christian is incompatible or mutually exclusive with libertarianism. So where did, where you land politically at this point? I think I’m like, pretty far right wing.

I don’t know how far. How are we talking funny mustache far? Um, I’m to the point where I’m like, you know, um, I’m not what people think funny mustache man was, but I’m willing to look into that whole thing and think that maybe it’s not the real story. That’s. What about, uh, what’s your concept of libertarianism? Did it change out from under you at any point? Or was it just always something that you got caught up in and then realized later on, like, what? It’s always fake and gay? Yeah, I don’t think it changed at all.

I think it’s, I think it’s just, you know, if you, classical liberalism is, will always get us to where we are right now. It’s not even that there’s bad actors running it and, like, self neutering it, like, philosophically is libertarianism. I think the purpose of it is to, is to get us to hear the, I think if you follow it down the line far enough, you just get right back to where we are. So, I mean, the next step in the current political sphere, if things just keep going the way they’re going and just naturally extrapolate that.

It does seem not an alarmist way, but not a full on civil war, but it almost seems that the sides have been getting emboldened with more and more people jumping off of the sort of like, little niche Green party and libertarianism and sort of either jumping on full board to, like, the two party or just completely abandoning the system altogether. But if either way, both of those seem to be steering towards these, like, two monolithic parties, and even though, like, the pretend little side green parties and third parties, those are almost silly, right? Like, I would almost assume that, like, the newer generations have to see that they’re never really the viable option.

Like, it’s either you play with the system and pick one of the big two, or you abandon the system altogether. But I don’t know. Either of those sound like they’re tenable. I think when you have a third party who’s, you know, that’s already split in half between, you know, gay race communists and people that are super spurgitive, you know, autistic dudes that are super into austrian economics, and then you elect Chase Oliver as your, your presidential candidate. I think that that’s an op that is designed to push people towards the orange guy. What’s it gonna take to get you to vote for, for Donald in this upcoming? Vote for him? I’m not.

Yeah. So as opposed to abandoning the battlefield, like, just pile on. I’m not gonna go out. I’m not gonna go out and stump for the guy or think that it’s gonna change anything, but I’m not gonna, you know, I’m not. Everything’s an op guy, but I think that there’s nudges and pushes from everywhere, and I don’t think any of us are smart enough to know the real, the whole story, but I think, I think pragmatic, man. I don’t, I don’t disagree with you because I’m, like, I’m not immune from any of this. I think my options are exactly the same.

It’s either, like, abandon the system or, in my case, become, like, a one issue voter, as stupid as that seems. Like, at least that’s the one thing that I can pretend might have something going for, even though I don’t even believe that the candidate that stands for specific issue would ever actually stand for that issue of push over. Yeah. Because, like, as my flavor of Christianity, like a one, you know, abort if we had abortion on the table as our one issue. I don’t have a, I don’t have a choice of, of anyone, you know, without.

If. If you basically could select. I mean, this is a hypothetical, right? This is not in reality, let’s just say that you had the choice to pick of all the candidates. You had, like, the last vote that was going to break the tie out of all these, you know, candidates that were running and they were all on single issues. Would abortion truly be above any, any other single issue that you could think of? I think so, yeah. And why is that in particular? I think it’s the most horrific sin that a human can commit. I think it’s a sin worse than murder.

Explain that. Because, I mean, murder is. I always considered it to be murder no matter what age. And that’s not in, like, a judgmental way, but I kind of feel like let’s at least call a spade a spade and then work from there. Like, it doesn’t like my opinion. I mean, Roman Catholic. So I kind of have, like, a bias going into this. And I’m definitely. I guess I would say I’m more pro choice, but not in, like, a militant way. In that I think that it should go on your record of, like, what your body count is.

Like, you should actually have, like, receipts somewhere in your permanent record that’s like, here’s how many people that you’ve murdered, just so that it’s, like, taken a little bit more seriously and not just like, oh, you know, the clump of cells kind of argument. I absolutely understand the more militant approach of, like, don’t condone it, don’t acknowledge it, don’t allow it to happen, because it’s like, if you say worse than murder. Yeah. The problem with, with having it on as a, you know, on your resume is that, you know, where I live, it would be a positive thing on a resume.

It would be, you know, to apply at Starbucks, you need four of them. I mean, I’m not going to argue against it, man. I feel that naturally, people on all extreme, because there’s absolutely examples of people that go out of their way to do it and flaunt it and make, like, a big deal out of it as if it were making some kind of a social statement, um, which is really weird to me. Like, I don’t, I don’t know if they’re going to, like, be burdened for, you know, uh, in hell for eternity and, like, regretting that, or if it’s, like, something that gets forgiven.

Because I. Because God is in his infinite wisdom and works in mysterious ways. It can, and I don’t want to get into a big theological debate on here because I’m not a theologian, but it’s, you know, you can come back from it. In our, in my religion, you know, you have to confess. I mean, even in my understanding, at least, of Catholicism, is that you can pretty much always come back from. And I mean, that’s why it’s, like, famous with the mafiosos, right? They’re like, yo, I can do what? And I can still get in. So that’s always been one aspect.

And I know that that’s a little bit of a fallacy because you have to actually change and accept God into your heart. Like, there’s prerequisites to it. You don’t just get to, like, wake up and be like, oh, my bad. And then all of a sudden, you know, you’ve got a blank slate. But I. But the difference is, for us, there’s no guaranteed salvation for any, for anybody. Explain that to me. This is. You talking about orthodox Christianity? Yeah, we don’t guarantee salvation. You have to live a life of repentance and prayer and fasting and, you know, if you do that, well, hopefully you make it.

Is there, is there a judgment process through St. Peter or is that outside of orthodox? I don’t know what the deal is with that whole part. Like I said, I’m not a theologian. We have a weird thing called the toll booths that some people agree with and some don’t in orthodoxy. And it’s like you go along this path and you revisit all the sins of your past and how you dealt with them and things like that. So, yeah, I mean, it’s just, it’s not that. Doesn’t it seem strange to you to just be able to say, like, oh, I believe in Christ, I’m saved, I’m going to heaven, and then you can do whatever, whatever you want for the rest of your life? Seems pretty sweet, bro.

Seems like the ultimate game genie, like, cheat code. Yeah, so we don’t have that. It’s where it’s a lifelong body of work and suffering. Are there any, um, are there any unforgivable sins at all? Because, I mean, one of the ones that’s really abstract that I’ve, I’ve learned about was like, denial of the Holy Spirit or blasphemy of the Holy Spirit or. But I don’t. I mean, I think that might be like a catholic specific thing. Yeah, I know we have, like, denial of the Trinity or worshiping with, you know, other, other religions or at another temple, but I’m not, I’m not quite sure if there’s any, like, mortal sins that you can’t come back from.

I don’t, I don’t believe. So the, the toll booth that you were just describing is that in the afterlife you go back and revisit, like, all the bad things that you’ve done? Yeah, it’s like a pathway along the way. Um, we don’t have, like, purgatory. So there’s a, there’s a modern, um, priest named Father Seraphim. Rose was from San Francisco and then lived in a monastery in northern California in Platina. And he wrote a book called the soul after Death. And it deals with that whole process, if anybody’s interested. And he also wrote some really great books on the UFO deception and things like that.

So there’s two other religions or denominations that remind me of this a little bit. Neither of us are theologians. So, like, one of my examples is Jack Chick from the old chick tracks. And one of, I think the very first chick track, the first big one, at least. I don’t mean like format big that he had big. The one that got popular was called this is your life, I believe. And the whole concept, I’ve got that one. A guy that came and did work on my house gave it to me after I told him that orthodoxy didn’t, didn’t guarantee salvation.

He got super mad at me. And then the next day he came back and gave me that track. I mean, but that, that, sure. I mean, okay, so Jack Chick had his own flavor. I don’t even know if you could pin it down as any particular denomination other than, like, jack T. Chick Christianity. But the whole premise of that pamphlet is that when you die, you have to go into like, this big movie theater with like, God on your right and, you know, Gabriel on your left or St. Peter on your left. And you got to, like, sit there and rewatch every bad thing that you’ve ever done, like, with an audience, you know, with the silver screen.

Is it you playing yourself or is there actors portraying you? I always thought it was like recorded, like, you know, the Star Trek. It’d be way cooler if it was like either a full on actor, like biopic with like a cool actor like Brad Pitt or Bradley Cooper. Or maybe that’s actually their hell, is that they have to go up to heaven and just play other people’s crappy lives over and over. Yeah, yeah. Or, or you could do like an id network, like reenactment. Really crappy, like reenactment version of it. I mean, the, the premise, though, I find to be really fascinating and also because California base.

But, uh, like the, some of the OG Rosicrucian books that I’ve read that came out of California, they describe this, this process of that. When you die, you, you don’t necessarily sit down in a movie theater with God, Jack Ghdem chick style, but you do relive all of your previous experiences, good and bad, but you do it in reverse. So, like, if you live to be 90 and you die, then you have to, like, relive 89, and then 88 and 87 all the way back until you get to the very beginning. But the thing is that if you’ve done a lot of horrible things in your life, you have to go back and relive all of those with the knowledge of the 90 year old.

So, like, every bad thing that you did is, like, a little shit five year old. Like, you’re doing that and you’re reliving it with the context and the scope of your whole life. So it feels, like, extra bad even for the stuff that you thought you did. So I always thought that was interesting because it’s also a rosicrucian practice. And I don’t know if this is, like, black magic or what. I think it’s more like hypnosis. But at the end of every day, as you lay down before you go to sleep, you’re supposed to relive that day in reverse.

So you think about what you did right before you got into bed. What did you do right before you were starting to get sleepy? And you go all the way back until, like, you know, waking up in that morning for the what if you specific sleep first. Well, then you screwed up, and then you got to try it again the next day. Because. Because the whole. The whole premise of doing that is that you’re training yourself for when you do die and you have to relive your life backwards. You already kind of, like, know how to process things in reverse order.

So you can take what would normally, you know, be another 80 years until you can get back to normal, and you can, like, cut that in half, or you can cut it into a quarter. So now it only takes 20 years to go back through your entire life. And then I don’t know. I don’t know what the purpose of that is. I just always thought that that was an interesting concept that’s based on top of this, like, reliving your. Your life with God next to you. Yeah. Yeah. I don’t know as much about the toll booths as I should to be speaking about it, but, yeah, I know that that’s there, but I also know that it is debated in the orthodox world as well.

Are there any things that are not debated? Is there anything that everyone agrees on, like, wholeheartedly within orthodox? I don’t know. I don’t. I mean, because to me, orthodox sounds almost monolithic. Like, orthodox means that you follow things to the t. But how could anyone ever agree on what those things are when it comes to Christianity? We don’t have, like, the pope, you know, that’s the difference. That’s, that was the skiz. That’s when. So if there was a debate within your church that you go to and there was a disagreement on, like, how to interpret something, who would you go to? Just the pastor or the father of that church? I think it would, you know, revert back to all the councils and, and apostolic succession and all that stuff.

I don’t. It’s not like a protestant church where you can kind of like, where each priest is or each pastor, if you go to like, a different baptist church, is going to have a different interpretation. So. Well, I mean, I. My catholic upbringing only allows me to understand this in the scope of a regular hierarchy. So it’s usually you’ve got your preachers and you’ve got your bishops and your cardinals, and all the way up at the top of the is the pope. And it’s almost like a Supreme Court president situation where if there’s ever a disagreement on whether something is canon or not canon or sinful or not sinful or whatever.

Yeah. Instead of the pope, we have. We would have Christ at the very top. So we don’t. Who’s talking to Christ to get his opinion? We don’t have the, the, I guess it would go to, you know, we have, we have the hierarchy. But if people are misbehaving, interpreting things the incorrect way, it can be remedied that way. It’s slippery slope territory. Right. Because it’s like, who’s. But you guys think that the pope is. That, you guys think that the pope is infallible? Well, Roman Catholics do. I don’t. I don’t identify as Roman Catholic anymore. I think that’s kind of silly that a human being could be infallible, but I do.

Yeah. I appreciate the role that the pope plays. So my view of Roman Catholicism is definitely heretical. It would not get me in anyone’s good graces in the Roman Catholic Church. But it’s almost like the pope represents the entire legal system, or like in the US. Right? We’ve got, when we first started out, we had the declaration of independence and the Bill of Rights, and then over time, now we’ve got stacks upon stacks where you could spend your entire life reading all the laws we’ve passed over the last 200 years, and you still wouldn’t get through them all.

The pope is kind of like the guy that represents all the laws that have ever been written about Christianity. So if anything ever comes up, he’s like the ultimate lawyer. That’s like, oh, we’ve got legal precedent. Let me go back into my book. So see here in this case, in 1200, there was this papal bull, this decree that settled this. The science has settled on this. So like, that’s done. Here’s the answer. We’ve got it all figured out. And the Roman Catholic Church, as I understand it, is just the amalgamation of every one of those, like Supreme Court decisions that happened within Catholicism.

So that if anyone ever has an idea, it’s never a new idea. If you ever come up with a heresy, they’ve already got it documented. It’s like the ultimate DSM slash. I don’t even know any other equivalent, but it’s the original corporate charter and all the corporate bylaws. I think that’s kind of what the Roman Catholic Church, and in a way it serves an interesting role because if you are into theology now, you’ve got the ultimate legal sort of cases to go back and look through and see what did the thinkers already determine on this 1000 years ago.

Yeah, but then you have like Vatican II in the sixties that the pope now supports. So if the pope’s infallible and he supports Vatican two, then if you don’t, that’s actually where I find Mormonism. Well, I think Mormonism is more appealing than Roman Catholicism just because it’s on a faster track. The Roman Catholic Church has all of these tendrils and it’s very slow because it’s so old and it’s so antiquated and legacy, and they have to deal with all these different denominations that they created, whereas Mormonism, they’ve streamlined it to where you almost expect every year, every four years or every like a half dozen years that they kind of say, oh, by the way, here’s the new interpretations.

We got this wrong and this wrong. We’ve changed this and we’ve dotted this I over here. So it’s like already in this constant dynamic flux where it doesn’t seem like, oh my God, they pulled the rope out from under us, oh my God, the pope went from this to this. In Mormonism, it’s almost like you expect a little bit of that stuff to come down and surprise you, which makes them more nimble, I guess. Am I selling you at all on becoming a Mormon? No, I don’t think so. So I mean, how do you know deep down that you’ve settled on like orthodox Christianity and like, this, this was the thing that you’ve been waiting on? Or do you not know that? I mean, I, you know, I’m not going to say I came to it the right way.

I came to it through. Through lockdowns and pandemic and living in a horrible place and seeing, like, the most evil things going on around me nonstop. Realizing that, you know, years, years and years of atheism since being, you know, being a Roman Catholic as a. I was confirmed Roman Catholic, and that was the last time I ever went to church. And, you know, I was in my forties and just feeling like there’s something missing. When was the last time you were at church before then? Are we talking like 13, or are we talking, like, I got confirmed when I was 17.

Okay. And I didn’t have to go to blood and eat the body and all that. I got. I took first communion when I was, like, ten. Okay. Okay. I went to. I actually did go to midnight Mass at the Vatican one year just because I was in Italy over Christmas, and I did take communion there, but I had. That was when I was, like, 22 or 21. 22, yeah. And then nothing. Atheism for. For 20 years, you know, dosed up with a healthy, unhealthy dose of a new age aa stuff, getting tricked into, you know, a lot of just this weird bay area, you know, crystal meditation stuff.

What was the weirdest thing that you believed at that point in your life? I was. I wasn’t a believer of anything, but I just was susceptible to go to do anything. You know, like people would. You know, people are reaching for things and are missing, miss. They have what they say in aa, like, a God sized hole that you’re trying to fill. And, um, you know, I would go to, like, like, meditation retreats or, like, think that, you know, Reiki healing might work or any, you know, just insert all the. All the barrier bullshit. And I was.

I was into, you know, in a whole handful of it. So, um. But, yeah, then fast forward, you know, we move up to Oregon. I’m living outside of Portland. I just see just the most disgusting, evil shit going on for, you know, three years. Um, no, I know that I want to, uh, I start feeling some weird, weird christian stuff. I know that, uh, I want to go check it out, and I know I don’t have any. I didn’t have any, um, protestant experience, which is strange for a lot of Americans to comprehend. Um, I know I didn’t want.

I knew kind of a little bit about sola scriptura, and that sounds super goofy to me. I knew I didn’t want to be roman catholic because, you know, everything that the Roman catholic church is famous for over the last 50 years was happening around me. At catholic school. And, you know, the next thing that I. That I kind of investigated was. Was orthodoxy. And I knew a little bit about it. When I lived in Oakland, there was a big, gigantic greek orthodox church up on the hill, and I just. I thought they were like catholics, but maybe a little stricter.

A lot of people in the. In the post libertarian sphere started talking about it. Vin Armani started, you know, making a pretty compelling case for it. I was listening to him a little bit, and, yeah, I did a podcast with. With my friend Buck Johnson, who was in the process of converting, and he knew some guys in Portland that were attending eastern orthodox church here. He gave my number to one of them. One of them called me. I went to my first liturgy on Pentecost, so almost two years ago and felt the presence of Christ as soon as I walked into our church.

And that’s the first time that it ever happened to me in my life. And, yeah, that’s it. I’m. What they would say is heart, not head. You know, I didn’t feel the need to, like, read every theological book or create a philosophy around it. It was what I felt inside. So. So you said your original impression was like. Like a more strict version of Roman Catholicism. How close to that were you, and what would you describe it as now? How strange was I to. You said your original impression of orthodoxy was that it was maybe like Catholicism, but stricter, maybe.

So, like, my understanding of catholic mass and, like, having been through, you know, liturgical services before made it so I could kind of follow along with what was going on. Although it’s extremely different in a. In a Russian orthodox church, you can kind of know what’s going on a little bit if you’ve been to catholic mass. I know that there’s extremely different theological differences. I don’t know how much stricter or anything like that is. I think we have, you know, there’s slight variances in rules and, you know, things on, like, birth control and divorce and things like that.

But to me, it wasn’t really about all that stuff. And I’m not Jay Dyer. I’m not trying to prove anybody wrong or I don’t have the knowledge or intelligence or background to do it, but to me, it was just feel. And I’m not the kind of guy that’s going to go and shame people for what kind of christian church they’re attending. We don’t judge anybody else’s salvation is what the priest told us in our first day of catechism. That sounded good to me. We’re not an evangelical church, but it is my job to just, I don’t want to say entice people, but to just live a good life and hopefully people recognize that and attraction rather than promotion and become curious about it and talk to me about it and maybe I can convert some people.

The word evangelical there is a really interesting one just because like, as you say that and you even kind of like mention this, that as you found Greek Orthodoxy or christian orthodoxy, eastern, what’s the difference between greek and Russian Orthodoxy? Is there a big difference? I think there’s some, some definite cultural differences I can’t really talk that much about. I’ve never been to greek orthodox service. I know there’s some definitely differences between the liturgies. I know a big one. It’s like we don’t have, we don’t have pews. We stand. But I think they might be a little bit more loosey goosey, kind of like Catholics, you know.

Well, but you mentioned you found russian orthodoxy and if anything, you almost like, like stop being as prevalent in podcasting and making this the social presence as a priority. You moved out of the city, you’re homesteading now. The point that I’m making is that it’s not like you found a new religion and then you immediately started like, and sign up for my Patreon. And here’s my new book about the religion I found. And here’s my t shirt that says, you know, like orthodoxy is, and there seems to be from the outside looking in that Christ is like hot right now and not hot and that everyone’s getting attracted and converting, but that it’s almost like financially a smart move to go all in on Christ and be very vocal about it and create podcasts and products and whole themes and brands around going like hard in the paint.

And I’m just, what’s your. Do you think there’s a lot of christian grifters? Do you think they’re easy to point out? I think there’s a lot of christian grifters. And I think that it’s also one of those things I talked about early on, like with libertarianism is like people get a new toy and they’re so excited about it. You know, people that are converts or catechumens or inquirers are going on Twitter, like orthodox Twitter is just gross. And it’s all these people that should note be speaking on things who are like, you know, telling people like, oh, you need to read this book.

And they, you know, like, this is like, just here’s my affiliate code, by the way. Yeah, I mean, not even that as much. It’s just people that are, like, coming, trying to come off as authorities who have no. No business doing it, you know? And, like, yeah, it’s, it’s bad. And I think there’s some people who are doing it for the grift. I think there’s some people that are doing it just because they’re so into it, and it’s just you need to, like, if you’re gonna do that, you’re supposed to, like, go talk to your priest.

You’re supposed to talk to your, your spiritual father and, like, talk to him about it. Like, if you’re not an experienced experience in the theology of the, of that religion, you know, you shouldn’t be coming off as authority, an authority to people. And if you’re not beholden to somebody above you, that can correct you, you know? So there’s a lot of that going on, and, yeah, I think there definitely is a lot of people grifting, and it just, it puts the, puts it in a bad light to a lot of people. May, it may attract some people, but it also pushes a lot of people away, and, and it’s just, it’s bad.

You know, I didn’t even know if anyone’s targeting specifically the orthodox religion, but you mentioned orthodox Twitter. Like, what’s orthodox Twitter all about? Like, what are the kind of things that you’re seeing? It’s people. It’s people telling people that they’re doing other. Doing it wrong. Oh, that shouldn’t be telling anybody anything. People that should be going to catechumen class and, like, catechism and learning. Learning from someone else, listening and not telling people what to do. You ever get, like, sucked out? I don’t know if you ever do. But there’s mean, you know, you get into one little subgenre, and it becomes your whole world, and you, like, a couple accounts, and the next thing you know, it’s like, all that’s on your, on your timeline.

And sometimes, you know, there’s. There’s the trad? Cat version of it and. And all that stuff. And, like, the trad what? Trad cat. Traditional Catholic, like, lat latin mass Catholics, um, you know, stuff like that. And it’s. It’s. It’s all there. And, you know, get, like, red pill, like, the manosphere and stuff kind of overlaps with all this stuff, and just so you have to create. What’s the manosphere? Manosphere is, you know, like, like Rollo Tomas, you like books, like, his, like, it’s just like the man man’s rights movement. You ever, oh, like, give me my foreskin back kind of thing? And, like, no, no.

It’s like talking. That’s like asking girls what their body count is and telling chicks that, like, if they’re 30 and don’t have kids yet, they don’t have any eggs and that they’re washed up. And, you know, I didn’t know there was a name. I mean, I noticed that that’s, like, a new genre. That’s really. It comes out of, like, the, you know, the. The pickup scene kind of, um, the, you know. Do you remember the game? Yeah, I don’t remember the game, but I know about the game. Strauss, right? Yeah. And then, like, there’s this guy, Rollo Tomas.

It’s like, it goes. That’s, um, you know, telling guys to get vasectomies, don’t get tied down, sleep with as many women as you can, travel perpetually, read voraciously, go swimming. You know, like, you could do all this stuff if you don’t have allow. You know, you don’t get traditionally married and things like that. That was an interesting movement, man, because, like, and it was like, the pickup artist or, like, the Pua movement. There was game. There was, like, a VH one reality show. Like, all those dudes got, like, really big for a small moment in time.

But, yeah, that stuff exploded right as I was discovering NLP and really, pickup art was really, someone just read NLP for marketing and self help and was like, I can use it. What’s NLP? NLP is neuro linguistic programming. Oh, right. It’s basically the backbone for what pickup artists built on top of and what you’re talking about, like the trad cat. Like, you know, what’s your body count? Slut? Like, that kind of talk. Yeah, that’s in orthodoxy. That’s an in orthodoxy as well, too, I think. So a lot of, you know, does that NLP stuff. Can we do a hard.

A hard segue into Aquino? Is that, like, kind of his stuff? Um, so. So my definition of NLP, which might not be the. The perfect one, but it’s more like some people are born charismatic. Right? Like Jim Jones, for example, of people’s Temple. Uh, there were stories that even when he was, like, seven, he was, like, going out and getting all the kids in the. The neighborhood and, like, preaching to him. Like, he was born with charisma. And there’s other people. Yeah, he’s doing. He’s doing animal funerals. Yeah, exactly. But even as weird as that was, apparently he made people feel very comfortable and kept coming to him because he just exuded rapport.

Like he knew how to develop rapport instinctually. I don’t think someone sat him down as a seven year old and like, here’s how you’re going to manipulate people’s feelings and here’s how you pay attention to body language and here’s how you respond to it. I don’t think that happened to possible. Maybe he was trained from the CIA as a baby, but if we just assume that maybe, maybe Dan Mitrione was visiting him when he was in his cradle. Well, but like some people even that I’ve met personally that you would never even know. But like some people are just born with charisma, like they are charismatic.

People that exist outside of like training for it. It’s like an inherent thing, but it’s also a learned skill. So NLP is basically people with no charisma, people that have no rapport, that just consider themselves, like outside that bubble, sat down and just analyzed people that had the skills and they write down every single trait and then they eventually come up with a list of patterns and it’s like, oh wow, what was it? Andrew Carnegie. I think it was like seven habits of highly successful people or how to make friends and make everyone like you. I know I’m butchering names of these, but this is exactly the same influence people and make friends or.

Right. And one of those is make sure that you always remember their name. Make sure you say their name when you meet somebody like at least three times. Like there’s all these like little shortcuts and, and this is where the NLP and the pickup artist and the ethics line maybe is under like debate sometimes. But I think that there shouldn’t be any difference at all that if you had to read it in a book or you had to go to training and someone had to say, remember people’s names, say it three times the first time you meet them and that will develop rapport and like consciously doing that versus Jim Jones is just like charismatic from birth and he just inherently knows to do all those things without being told it.

So that’s my impression of NLP, is that it was just like a list of heres the things that highly successful socially people do to build rapport with other people and heres how you can apply it, and heres how you can test it and stuff. That was the original concept of NLP. So when you bring up Michael Acquino, I think that people use NLP because it helps you build rapport, but then they can use those things for whatever purpose they want. So if you go into a room and you know that you could be the most popular guy in there, if you shake everyone’s hand, you say everyone’s name three times, and no one else is doing that now, all of a sudden, you almost stand out as, like, a leader because everyone’s like, oh, yeah, did you meet that Michael go? Yeah, he remembered my name.

Oh, I got a really good vibe from him. And if you can get a whole room of people that are, like, built rapport with you, now you can form a cult and go and take over whatever small city that you want. Yeah. And it takes a special kind of person that has born with that and then wants to do that as well, because I don’t want to talk to anybody, you know? Well, but you could also be the one that just wants to do it, doesn’t know how to do it, and then you discover NLP, and now.

And that’s kind of the best example of, like, pickup artists, right? Where, like, a lot of pickup artists work, what you would describe a guest modern is like an incel, like, involuntary celibate, and didn’t know what that, like, what am I doing wrong? And then some pickup artist was like, here’s some NLP techniques. But now, instead of building rapport with people around you for business deals, or instead of doing it for your own self, like, here’s how you can destroy other people’s rapport. Here’s how you can chip them down and by proxy, like, lift yourself up over it, which is that whole negging concept where you’re supposed to walk into a room and if someone greets you and they smile, you’re like, oh, you got something in your teeth.

Like a little thing just so that you throw them off their game, and now they’re not so confident. And if you can do that subtly enough, that’s kind of what the original. And I would consider that, like, the black hat version of NLP, like, hitting on the fat girl instead of her super hot friend. Well, I mean, kind of, but that would actually, you’re. You’re showing higher worth to the people around without doing anything, like, inherently bad or negative or destroying, like, the teeth thing, or, like, just giving people, like, a weird one is hot, cold stuff.

Like, in knowingly love bombing someone and giving them the cold shoulder and then love bombing them again and just repeating that process. Like, if you know that you’re doing it in order to manipulate someone’s emotional state. Like, that’s on the verge of black hat, like, unethical. You’re kind of a scumbag. Yeah. Charles Manson on the ugly chick. Okay. It’s the same. It’s a similar premise, though, because the whole concept is you’re just building rapport. Like, if it were a video game, you’re just trying to improve your points. And once your points get so high, then just like, any girl wants to bang you.

That’s kind of the premise of being a pickup artist, an NLP. It’s like, if you get the points high enough, they’ll buy that car or they’ll buy that freaking whatever the hell chotchkey you’re trying to sell them. That’s like the salesman version of it. But then there’s also the self defense version of it where now, if you understand NLP and all those tactics and you’re in front of Michael Aquino and he’s trying to, like, sell you on his cult religion, you could be like, oh, this dude is one of my favorite one is called spatial anchoring.

And that’s where if I’m talk. If I’m talking to you, imagine I’m here, I’ll back up a little bit. So imagine that every time I make. I want to make a really good point with you that you. I want you to agree with. I’ll do something with my hands over here on this side. So I’ll be like, everyone agrees with this. We have to do this. But then I’ll start being like, yeah, but there’s people over here that I don’t know. I don’t really know about them. You can’t really trust the people on the other side.

And now that I’ve kind of established to you, like, this is the good side, that’s the bad side. I can reinforce that a few times, go off on a tangent, come back from that tangent 510 minutes later, talk about something completely else. And now I know every time I talk about, say, Joe Biden or every time I talk about Donald Trump and Joe Biden’s over here, like, I don’t have to tell you that Joe Biden’s good if I say him and I put my hands on this side and Donald Trump’s bad if I say it over here, I could just be like, Donald Trump and Joe Biden.

So that concept of, like, spatial anchoring is a really powerful one. That, again, like, some people just inherently do that because they’re almost, like, visually plotting out, like, a memory palace in front of them. Yeah, it’d be really interesting to hear somebody that knows a lot about that and can. Can pick it out to watch. Did you see that Dave Smith debated Chris Cuomo on Patrick Bette David’s show about COVID stuff last Friday night? Who won? I mean, obviously, Dave Smith tore him to shreds, but Chris Cuomo is just doing stuff with his hands all the time.

They would show. They would Chris Coleman say, like, oh, well, I never did that. I never said that. I never laughed about Joe Rogan taking Ivermectin. And then they would, like, show the clip of him and Don Lemon, like, chuckling about Joe Rogan taking horse paste. And then he would just like. And then they would go back to the debate, and you just be like. You talk about how that that didn’t happen, how he was. He was talking about something else, and it was. I mean, it takes a special kind of person to be able to lie that way, you know, I mean, that could be construed as an NLP, and he was doing shit with his hands the whole time.

So it works on some people at such a subconscious level that you don’t know it. But, yeah, like, if you know about what spatial anchoring is another really good example. If you have ever done, like, in person sales where you had to go and buy, like, a car, a tractor, whatever, from, like, the dude that makes the commission right there with you, they’ll pull this weird touchy feely crap with you where they’ll, like, touch you on your elbow, or, like, they’ll, hey, bud, how’s it going? Like, they’ll. They’ll, like, make physical contact with you, and they’ll usually do that as a physical anchor.

So every time they want to, like, drill in a great deal or, like, make you feel, like, supercharged, they might give you one of those little bumps. It’s almost like a little, like, a little boost. And every time they say, like, oh, you know, I’ll get you ten grand off. You know, bump, bump. When they say that kind of stuff. Yeah. And again, they don’t maybe don’t know what they’re doing. I would assume a lot of them do. Like, they actually have gone through sales training, and they tell them, like, touch people if they’re kinetic and all this stuff.

Yeah, it’s sleazy, man. It feels so gross to me to try to sell anything to anybody. It’s. I don’t know, man. I mean, it’s like, at a certain point, you’re either selling something to someone or you’re working for somebody. And those are almost like the only two options that you’ve ever got. Yeah, entrepreneurship, I guess, would be a different, different way to do it, too. And I know you’re now almost like a defunct libertarian, but you got into the nerd politics of the economics and stuff, so you could at least have a few coherent philosophies, I guess, even if you no longer back them.

But I’m just curious, because one of the things that I always struggled with, with libertarianism, which I only really agree with in the scope of, like, everything should be legal. And I know that’s, like, an oversimplification. And I don’t mean everything unanimously, but, like, drugs and, you know, loud music and pretty much everything dangerous fireworks should all be legal. Yeah. It’s the non aggression principle. It’s like, as long as I’m not aggressing against anybody, you know, I’m not. As long as it’s a victimist crime. And, you know, it falls apart under any scrutiny really fast because that’s subjective, for one, what, what aggression is.

And then, you know, um, I think that there’s, like, more ways to, like, destroy culture and society than to just, you know, physically injure someone. Well, and a lot of it breaks down for me in, like, the most technical and boring way possible. But my, my go to example to have them come up with everyone, is that, what if I’ve got a horse and my horse accidentally, like, I don’t do it, but my horse kicks the shoemaker’s son in the head, and he’s dead now. And, like, no one was necessarily at fault, but now the only guy that makes shoes in my whole town doesn’t want to sell me shoes anymore because he’s got a grudge against me because my horse killed his firstborn kid or whatever.

Yeah. And if you’re, like, if you’re a libertarian spur, you’d say, well, that guy needs to be made whole for his son. So they would go to a third party, you know, arbitrator, and he would decide what that little boy’s life was worth. And then the, the guy who owned the horse would have to make him whole. It would be something like that. It’s like, exactly what we have now with a lawsuit. Yeah, exactly. And, and the other, the other will get, which is also not philosophically consistent, which, as you’ve learned, doesn’t matter all that much when it comes to, like, converting people or getting in their minds, but that, oh, well, then you can make your own shoes, or you just find another shoe and it’s like.

But that’s, that also reveals how a monopoly would kind of start within that society, because now another guy starts making shoes. And the first shoemaker, hypothetically, is like, hey, you know what? You can sell shoes in this town, but we don’t sell shoes to Adam because his horse killed my kid. And the other shoemaker is like, no problem. You know, one guy, fine. We can just not sell that guy’s shoes. Now you’ve got private. Is private. Private company, bro. Yeah, exactly. Start your own. Start your own Amazon. That’s the hardest one. Yeah, like, the, another great one is just like, like, you know, it’s all these libertarian college professors.

They, they’re all pedos. They want to argue, like, the age of consent. I don’t know if you ever remember when Thaddeus Russell got in big trouble for that, because he was interviewing this guy from some state university in New York, gay jewish guy. Who’s Thaddeus Russell? Was he a libertarian? He’s like a, he was like an, a leftist anarchist who kind of had a moment. He was kind of like the right wings, one of the right wings, pet leftists for a little bit, you know, kind of like they’re James Lindsay for a second, and, uh, he had this, this, this professor, this libertarian professor on his show, and they were like, talking about how the age of consent should, should be like two and that so horrible.

And, uh, yeah, like, you’ll, you’ll really quickly get in, get into those kind of arguments. And was this, was this like a debate to show the. It wasn’t even a debate. It was just a guy he had on his podcast. And, I mean, I’m just trying to search for, out of all the millions of things that you could even project out into the world vocally with your voice. Like, what, what is the point? If you were to be devil’s advocate in this guy, you know, if you were this spur, what would even be the point of arguing for an age of consent of two? Like, what? Who benefits from that? I mean, petos.

Well, yeah, just, just politicians, I guess. Yeah. So I don’t know how we got there, but, yeah, that’s the kind of thing that’ll happen. And. Oh, but what I was gonna say is, like, say this guy, this really rich guy, Jeff Bezos, he, he’s made a billion dollars. It’s a anarcho capitalist society. He’s got a big, big compound, big piece of property, hires private army, and he wants to make the age consent on his property. Everybody can come live there. He wants to make the age of consent six years old. So parents who agree with that can bring their kids, and their kids could consent to sex with adults.

And, uh, yeah, I mean, now you’re just describing the finders, which is just another, like, everything that they’re trying to do. Like, the CIA has already done it, like, so. Yeah, so if you’re, if you’re an, if you’re an anarchist who’s against that, and you say, like, well, I wouldn’t allow that. I really like, okay, well, what would you do about it? Would you create your own private army and go fight the billionaire’s army and declare war on them? That sounds like aggression to me. What if they made a, what if they made a religion around it and then you were attacking their culture and their religion? Oh, I guess this is where.

Where I’m an absolute ignorant bumpkin when it comes to, like, the fine details of libertarianism, but I would. I guess I’ve always assumed that religion is truly separated from libertarianism. Like, at no point does your religion give you any extra rights or special privileges within libertarianism. There’s never a race card. There’s never a religion card. This, again, isn’t the platonic ideal of everything. And I realize that race and religion would probably play some kind of impact, but a true die hard libertarian seems that all of that would be completely superficial now. Yeah, I’m not sure. Maybe.

Okay, so we say there’s no religion around it. What, what would be the, what would be the libertarian solution to not wanting a ranch where six year olds get raped? I honestly don’t know. It almost feels like a religious thing because let’s say. Let’s say when we first started talking about this, you mentioned that, like, abortion being like, a one issue thing, like a very serious issue, worse than murder. So now it’s like, what if you find out that there’s an abortion clinic, like, within 50 miles of you, and they’ve just, like, 1 billion served or whatever, they’ve got the big golden arch or whatever, and you just see the numbers just ticking all the time.

And if you truly believe that this is, like, the worst thing that could, anyone could ever do, like, either you just accept and you’re like, God, you know, let God judge them. He’ll sort them all out. Or you’ve got, like, the militant ones that are like, I’m going to become a Knights Templar right now, and I’m going to go and sort this out on behalf of g man. It’s the exact same thing when you’re talking about these anarcho capitalists that want to set up like a weird commune that anything goes. It’s kind of the same decision, like let them be and hope that something stops them or they just find out in the end or rally the troops and go and take them on.

And if they’re a, a billionaire, that should almost not matter as much. Unless now you’re setting up for a generational sort of warfare, which again, just feels like what we’ve got now anyways, just with, you know, less steps. Yeah. So what do we do? We’re just screwed no matter. Even if libertarians come into play. It almost just seems that. And, but I don’t think, I mean, why are we even talking about them? Because it’s, it’s a moot point. Like there’s no power there. Well, I guess the point being that right now we’ve got this very sophisticated, not in a good way, but highly sophisticated, overly complex system where all the exact things seem to play out the same way that in a heavily reduced system where it’s just libertarianism and aggregate bartering systems.

Some of the promise, I guess, is I always understood from libertarians to try to court me, which deaf ears. But it’s almost like, see, it’s so much simpler. See, the rules make so much more sense and you don’t have to have law degrees and you don’t have to navigate the system with some kind of a government liaison because you’re just a monster in the eyes of the court. That’s part of the promise of it, is that it just goes back to good old fashioned, but it seems that the exact same hypotheticals that play out in that good old fashioned libertarian society, it’s just like the simpler version of exactly how it plays out now.

It’s almost like the religions and the governments and the structures that grow around us are adapting to us rather than us trying to adapt to them. Yeah. Yeah, I agree with that. I don’t think like the free market, the ultimate free market, I don’t think shipping every american manufacturing job overseas and destroying the middle class is necessarily a good thing. You know, I think that’s harmful to our culture and our society. And so it doesn’t seem like there’s any, putting that genie back. Are you trying to argue? What’s, what are we even talking about? Well, it’s just you had like a, like a journey, right? That where you went from being completely leftist, which I interpret as being like pro state, give the state all the power, gave him more money, let him pass more laws, let him pass more taxes.

I mean, I wasn’t even sophisticated enough at that point to consider anything. Okay, so it was more just like team blue versus the nuances of what that entailed. Right? So then my. My assumption is that when you switch to libertarianism, which you subsequently left, but that was a more informed, because you talked about reading Rothbard and trying to debate people and pick out the philosophical inconsistencies with their own stances, which seemed that now you had a more active interest in all these political machinations. Right? So you went from ignorant team Blue to feeling like you were well informed enough to try and convert other people reading the materials to now, I guess, leaving that and being a little bit more apathetic about it.

And now it’s like, you’ll vote for orange man bad for the sake of. Like, that’s the simple option that we’ve got. So if you’ve kind of gone through the full game, it’s like that weird meme where it’s like the bumpkin at the far end of the bell curve, and then you’ve got, like, the stressed out nerd that thinks he’s, like, the highly enlightened one at the top of the bell curve, and then back at the exact same position, you’ve got, like, the Jedi that’s on, like, the same level as the. The bumpkin. I don’t know if you know, I’m talking about the visual.

I don’t have that meme on my. My timeline. But I can. I can understand it. I think so. But the concept. I don’t think I’m a Jedi. I think I’m more of a bumpkin. Well, but it’s all things being equal, right? It’s almost like you started in ignorance. You develop, like, you read all the things, and you’re like, okay, I understand the ins and outs, and then you realize, oh, that never mattered. So you kind of, like, start back where you’re at, but you’re in a place where you’ve been through that journey. And I guess that’s the point of, like, all of these weird inconsistencies with libertarianism and the current political structure now that it almost seems that it takes up a lot of loose energy to debate all these weird nuances about it, when ultimately things seem to work out exactly the same regardless of the system that they’re trying to work themselves out in.

Does that make sense? Yes. It all became much less important to me once I got out of the city. I guess it doesn’t. I don’t see, like, the bad on quite the scale that I did before. Most days I’m on a farm with. With sheep and chickens and, uh, yeah, I mean, that’s about it. Like, it doesn’t. What do you miss about the city? Um, I guess I miss convenience sometimes. Um, or variety of things. Um, it’d be nice to not have to drive 35 minutes to go to jiu jitsu and have more than one choice of where I could do it, but.

Or like, if I forgot milk at the grocery store to. Not to be able to go back and get it, and so I’d have it for my coffee in the morning. But it’s just stuff like that. That’s it. I have a hard time operating in the city now. It’s like sensory overload. I’m in the city on Sundays. I go to church and right outside of Portland, and then I go help my wife at her work. And it’s a culture shock every week. Can you point out a city folk yet? Like, are you like, so far removed that you can tell when a city slicker shows up by mannerisms or, like, I don’t know.

I mean, I don’t live that far. I live close to a town. I live 30 minutes from a town. But I mean, most of the people, I could tell most of people who live around me because they’re like, obese and use rascal scooters at Walmart, but there’s a lot of that. No, there’s people that have lived out here generationally, and there’s people with cattle and livestock and things like that. But, you know, there’s some people that have recently moved out here, I guess, but not. Not very many. If things go to hell and like, let’s say the city just shuts down or whatever, you become isolated in the town that you’re at within like a, I don’t know, 2030 miles radius or something.

How. How homestead are you? Like, do you got animals and plants and vegetation and crops and things that could last you indefinitely? Or, like, how have you figured out the math and, like, exactly how long your supplies would last until you’d have to go and venture out, like zombie apocalypse style? I don’t. I don’t raise, I don’t have any vegetables. I don’t garden. I have livestock. But the purpose of moving out here wasn’t to prep or to get ready for the end. Like, it’s just to have a more enjoyable life and not have to be around like bums and piles of human feces.

Fair point. And I didn’t, I didn’t mean to imply prep. No, I know that, like, a self sustaining lifestyle. And that when I thought that I was going to do that was in my peak libertarian years. I’ve got stockpiles of ammo and I unregistered things out in the shop out there. And, uh, I have no, I don’t, I don’t think that any of it would do me any good if it all went bad. I mean, in the short term, maybe, like, like when you’re talking about measuring days or weeks, but yeah. And like, the ultimate scheme of things, I got, like, I got, I got three chest freezers full of beef and pork.

I’ve got a generator. I’ve got generator switch over power at my house. That’s for when it snows out here. It’s not for when the grid goes down. Uh, you can just, like, blink one eye if you don’t want it to directly. But, like, are, are there any militias that you’ve, uh, encountered out there? Like, little, you know, vigilante parties or anything? When we first moved out here, it was the height of lockdowns. And, you know, I live in northwest Oregon. It was, it was happening here. You know, luckily, we got out of the immediate Portland area and, you know, you didn’t have to comply.

Up here, where I’m at, I operate in northwest Oregon and southwest Washington. I live right by the Columbia River. I could take a bridge over to Washington. That’s where I go to, like, Home Depot and stuff. And nobody was. I mean, there was a lot of fat mega boomers who were wearing masks over there, but, you know, you didn’t have to. Um, so when we first moved out here, we were driving, you know, we were driving home one day and we saw on, like, a power pole right by our house, like, a flyer for, like, some, like, United Patriots group that was, like, meeting in crazy town, which is right by where I live.

I just doxed myself, I guess, um, pre recorded. We’ll, we’ll replace that with somewhere nice. Beverly. Cool, thanks. Um, but, um, we’re like, well, we don’t really know anybody out here. Maybe, you know, I’m. I was considering, uh, leaving my job at the time. I was like, maybe I could go out there and meet some people that need, you know, just odd jobs done. I could make a little bit of money and meet some people. And we went out there, and it was like a full on, like, q tard meeting in, like, this baptist church. And they, like, handed us, like, a copy of the constitution.

When we went in, we had to say the pledge of allegiance. And, like, they were. They were cute people who had just, like, woken up, and we’re talking about really, really dumb stuff. And, uh, we stayed for about 20 minutes and then. And then left. Were you ever in the Q movement? Did you ever get. No, I wasn’t. You know, like, I remember hearing about it when it first started, and I tried. How did you dodge that? Because you were, like, right in the thick of. Of, like, the prime real estate for that. Yeah. I couldn’t figure out how to work four chan.

I don’t believe that. Four chan.org slash poll. Done. Yeah, I went on four chan. I’d never been on. I don’t play video games, so I’d never been on, like, a message board site like that. Okay. And it didn’t really make sense to me what was going on. So I just kind of. I kind of, uh. I never went back. I just kind of. I would listen to people talk about it and. And stuff like that and maybe thought that there was some validity to it for, you know, the first couple months that I knew about it.

But then after a while, you know, I was in a peak, peak libertarian mode at that point, was, like, pretty against, uh, Donald Trump as well. Um, another group I did, um, when we lived closer to Portland, I was in. I got into the freedom cell movement, which was kind of, like a libertarian, anarchist, agorist like, group of people who are meeting up around the pandemic and, like, bragging to each other about how they didn’t wear masks and how they wanted to, like, move out of the city and get land. So I would go to those meetups, like, monthly.

And it was, you know, that’s kind of what started, like, souring me towards. Souring me away from that movement was meeting actual anarcho capitalists in the real world. We went to some freedom festivals and stuff, and I told this story before, but I’m an old punk rocker, and when I show up to a freedom festival, it’s like, oh, I thought we were going to be trying to end the fed, but it looks like fish parking lot here, a parking lot at a fish concert. And, like, there’s just hippies, white people with dreadlocks spinning around in circles doing, like, massive amounts of drugs and just, like, doing nothing.

So, um, yeah, I mean, that’s. That’s where it all started kind of going downhill for me. I mean, I think that both of us were. We’re almost like, target demo for that kind of thing. It didn’t pick up for me because I. I almost feel like I had earned my conspiracy stripes because the same way that a lot of people that went hard into Q, like, the Facebook group style cues, it was that same dynamic that you were describing before about the kid that finds the shiny toy and, like, he just wants to, like, show it off to everyone and talk about it to everyone indefinitely.

So you’re saying you were. You were a little bit further down the road than, like, then, like, somebody’s aunt found out about maybe that there might be some high level pedophilia or something like that? Well, I mean, so. So, I mean, I listened to Alex Jones back before he, you know, back in, like, the late nineties or the early two thousands at least. And I read, like, one of my claims to fame. Now, I guess I’m still not proud of it because it definitely screwed up my. My path in life. It reduced my number of options.

But in the military in 2003, I got restation to go to Afghanistan. And part of that was that I had to get an anthrax vaccine along with a whole bunch of other ones. Know what time I just said the v word for the YouTube edition? But I remember at that point, man, and I went back home and I just went onto the Internet, and I was like, what’s in the av thing? Did you feel. Did you feel anything when it went into you? Well, the long story short is I didn’t get it, but I didn’t get it to the point of getting an Lor and an LLC and article 15 and eventually a bad conduct discharge for not following orders, along with a litany of other things.

I wasn’t a perfect person, but that ended up being the catalyst. And this is 2003, and I remember when the avian bird flu made a big resurgence in, like, zero five or zero six. Then a couple years after that, there was, like, the swine flu thing, and everyone I knew, literally everyone I knew on all sides were all about, let’s go get the Tamiflu. Let’s go stock up. Let’s go and get all the shots and everything. And I just. At a certain point, maybe just as being like, like, out of the spite, but it’s like, if I got kicked out of the military for rejecting this v, like, I’m just going to reject every v.

Like, like, there’s not a special one that, like, oh, that one I’ll take. So when the 2019 2020 thing came around and all these people are, like, waking up, and it was just like, bro, like, talk to me 17 years ago. Like, I have been on this boat since before you even knew there was a boat in the water. The James Franco meme. First time. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And the same thing, too, with all the QAnon stuff where they were like, did you know that top level officials are actually, like, kidnapping children was like, yeah. Because I literally read the Franklin scandal by John de camp in, like, the early two thousands while I was in the Franklin area.

Franklin cover up. Franklin cover up. Yeah, Franklin scandals. The Nick Bryant version of that. So, I mean, yeah, when, when all the Q stuff came out, every single thing that was like the big news breaker. I was like the hipster James Franco every time, just like, oh, that’s cute. No, you just found out about that. No, that’s cool. That guy, the most recent self immolation guy, did you see, like, his manifesto? I did. I know. I was like, he was talking about, like, like, kindergarten stuff. He was talking about, like, the Federal Reserve and stuff like that.

That’s, that’s what he, it was just like 101. Like, yeah, Alex Jones 1999 stuff, but a leftist version. And he’d, like, figured found out about some stuff and then lit himself on fire. I mean, it’s a sick litmus test or a metric to go by, but I just wonder, with that guy’s constitution, what point in my life I would have self immolated if I had that same approach to reality. Right? Like, would it have been in zero three? Would it have been in, like, 2001 when I realized I was in the military fighting, helping gear up for a war that was based on, like, a self inflicted wound, you know, like a false flag? Like, I don’t know, what, at what point do you just set yourself on fire? And also, you know, no offense to that, dude, but it kind of didn’t work.

Like, I, again, I am the Target demo for whatever he was trying to convey. And I guess I didn’t. All I knew about him was that he set himself on fire like a weirdo. And I didn’t know anything about his manifesto. Yeah. Until I just brought his name, his memory up. Nobody thought about him for the past month. I didn’t know. You assume that he’s got a manifesto, but it’s like, you know, it was like, it was Reddit, Reddit tear stuff. Like, well, and funny enough, because I was technically capable of getting onto four chan and all this stuff, so it bypassed me just because I felt like they were just regurgitating things that I had already sort of integrated into my entire weird mindset.

But one of the biggest ones. And this is where I saw a weird QAnon Trump sort of, like, converging in a way. And it was for me personally, because in Orlando, they had the Pulse nightclub shooting. And it’s literally like, like you could probably hear it if someone shot a gun at that intersection right now. I could hear it. It’s like, very. I’m happy you didn’t go. I’m happy you decided to stay in that night. It was, it was the one night I had, we had an Orgy here at the House. We didn’t have to go and pick up the Twinks.

Yeah. But, like, that particular event, as it’s happening in real time, there was Reddit threads on, like, News and on, like, all these, you know, the Big Reddits. And then I’m, like, seeing in real time them all just disappearing. And it’s like, what the hell is going on? Like, I want to know what’s happening a couple miles away. The News doesn’t have it because the News is like a Freaking Day behind now at this point. And Reddit and Twitter and Four Chan, and basically Reddit was, like, the most up to date. So, long story short, I eventually found the only Subreddit that was still covering it in Real Time was this thing called the Donald’s.

And I had no idea that it was about Donald Trump. I mean, obviously, I did within, like, a few minutes of going on there. But for whatever reason, the Donald subreddit was the only place on the Internet that had up to date information on the pulse nightclub shooting. And I was like, that’s weird. I subscribed to it, and all of a sudden, I’m getting these QAnon. I didn’t know what QAnon was at that point, but I’m getting these memes now on my feed because I’m part of this group that was the only place to get the nightclub shooting.

And the same thing happened. I don’t know how long it was after that, but it was like six months or a year. There was the, the France shooting and, like, their thing where the guys had eagles. The death metal one. Exactly. Yeah, the death metal one. Exact, like, literally the exact same thing happened. It’s in world news, it’s in news now. It’s gone. All the threads, they’re all gone. You know where it’s at? It’s in the Donald. This same thing happened. There was like a Selena Gomez concert where somebody got shot in that one. Same thing.

So at a certain point, like now, I started looking at the Donald subreddit as the only place that I could go for reliable news when things were too spicy for mainstream media. And I don’t know if it was, like, you anon had co opted it already or if they also saw that dynamic of, like, oh, wow, people are going to this one place. They’ve got a monopoly on, like, real things happening in real time. Let’s go ahead and co op that and start injecting Cuna. Like, I still have no idea where it started and where it ended.

Where, like, the QAnon and the Donald and, like, covering this. This, you know, sort of taboo news coverage, all conflated, but they all, like, turn into, like, a perfect sphere. And that. That’s what swallowed a lot of people up and got them into conspiracies and into Donald Trump and into, like, the whole QAnon rabbit hole. Yeah, that was a fun time. Did that shooting happen during Donald Trump’s presidency? Uh, I don’t. Honestly, don’t you mean that the pulse? I don’t think so. Okay, so there was already a Donald subreddit before his presidency. Let’s see. Pulse nightclub shooting was in June 12, 2016.

I think he would have. And he was in June. Oh, no, sorry. Yes. He would have been in, like, January of 2016. So, yeah, I guess. Of course. I mean, that wouldn’t have happened in Obama administration or Hillary Clinton administration. That never would have happened. Right? No. You know what, though? It was. It was around elections, because I distinctly remember them campaigning. And then the. The father of the guy. Yeah, there’s some weird shooting was, like, in Hillary Clinton campaigns and stuff, like, on tv, like, in the background, just standing there. Dude, that is such a deep.

Like, that one never really got the deep dive that it deserves. I don’t know if I’m the one to do it, but, yeah, like that, dude, what a weird freaking story. And the guy’s wife was, like, either cast as being completely absent minded, like, to the point where it probably was illegal for her to even get married to, like, an adult because she had, like, the thought process of, I don’t know, like, a nine year old or something. Or at least that’s how they portrayed her on the news. The dad shows up. Like, all this stuff was really sketch about the entire operation.

Yeah. Very, very weird. So where are you at on conspiracy theories now? Do you even care anymore? Or is. Is that all, like, superficial, material, earthly stuff? It definitely is, but it’s a lot of fun still for me. I’m at. I’m a. I’m a program to kill guy. It’s about all I really care about these days, just reading that book and then being able to look at all this other different parapolitical stuff through that lens. I’m not really getting into any weird woo woo stuff. I just like looking at, like, patcon and, and, you know, different serial killers and things like that.

And once you read. Once you read program to kill, it makes it really enjoyable because you can go out and, and I don’t know if enjoyable is the right word, but I do enjoy it. You can go out and kind of consume Normie podcasts and media and documentaries and Netflix series and interpret it through the lens of programmed to kill. The genius 2004 novel by Dave or not novel, nonfiction book by Dave McGowan. So you’re kind of in the heartland for, like, bigfoot sightings. Is that considered woo woo? Like, where are you at on Bigfoot? I’m open to Bigfoot.

I hear weird stuff out here all the time. And definitely, I grew up in the Pacific Northwest. My grandma’s from Washington state, and I was raised with stories of her encounters and. Yeah, like, when I used to have to be at work at 630 in the morning in Portland, I’d leave here at 430. And, uh, I hear weird whoops and knocking and, and things like that. So definitely, uh, definitely open to Bigfoot. Cryptids. I like all that stuff, but it’s not something that’s really, uh, captured my heart and held on to it as much, uh, these days.

All right, well, we’ll start to wrap this up, and I’ve got a final little segment that I think will be fun to ask you now, since, uh, your, your thoughts and feelings might have changed since we first started talking a while ago. So let me just play the intro, and we’ll get into it. Hey, conspiracy buffs, I double dare you to take some PC, the paranormal conspiracy probe. On your marks. Get set and go. All right, the goal is just to get a temperature check from you on how much you believe certain conspiracy. I don’t like that description.

What? The PCP paranormal conspiracy probe temperature check. Okay, well, we’re going to give you a litmus test. Does that feel any better? Yeah, I guess. I took my dogs to the veterinarian today, so it’s fresh in my mind. Well, if it helps, it is going to be an anal thermometer. Okay, cool. As long as it’s, you know, explained beforehand. So, uh, just on a scale of one to ten, one meaning you don’t believe it all. Ten meaning you do believe it. So if we said bigfoot, one to ten, how much do you believe that Bigfoot is legitimate real phenomenon? Six.

Okay, how about flat earth? Eight. What about dinosaurs? Zero. What about fire breathing flying dragons? Four. About little gray aliens? Zero. David Icke reptilians? Zero. A class of giants that lives inside of hollow earth? If you take David Ike out of that, I say seven. Oh, really? What’s the, what’s the delineation between a David icke reptilian and just a non David ick reptilian? One’s gnostic and one isn’t. Which is the gnostic one? The David Ike one. Really? Okay, I want to get into that a little bit. One to ten. That I could order a book off of Amazon that tells me how to summon a demon, and I could summon a demon in my room with that book.

I think the Necronomicon is available on Amazon. Ten. So let’s say I did that, and I read the Necronomicon, and I actually tried to summon a zazel. Okay. What do you think is the likelihood that someone could actually summon a legitimate demon from a freshly printed book? On the point here being that, like, you didn’t have to go and find some ancient grimoire that’s got blood soaked and you had to get an eye of a newt. Like, I just buy something, prime, it shows up on my doorstep. I open it up, it’s freshly printed. No one’s ever seen it before.

I read it, and I try and summon a demon based on what it told me within the confines of my desk here, how likely is it that I could actually summon a demon through that? Seven. What about angels? Do you think you can summon angels? I don’t. I think five. How much do you think you could recognize an angel for what it is on one to ten? Like, if one just showed up to you spontaneously, would you know it’s an angel? I don’t. I. One? I don’t think we have the discernment to. What about dog man? You know about dog man? Yeah, I’ve done plenty of podcasts on dog man.

I’ll give it a three. Well, what about chupacabras? I’ve been to Puerto Rico. No evidence of two. So I already know that you gave flat earth, like, a seven or an eight. So this in the context of the having being open to flat earth, that a human being has stepped foot on the moon in the last hundred years and zero is still. Is it one the lowest or zero the lowest? Whatever. Yeah, one or zero. That’s my litmus test for people. So. So I just wanted to point out that I have had someone that said they believed in flat Earth, but also believe we stepped foot on the moon.

And they explained it, and I think it was my friend Maverick approach, but he explained it, that if the moon is local, it’s actually a better chance that we could step foot on the moon than if it were in the real model, on the globe model, where it’s all the way out in space, hundreds of thousands of miles away. That if it’s local that you could potentially visit it, or it would make more sense that you could visit it. I don’t know. I thought that was an interesting. So is he claiming that the moon is within it or if it’s within the dome or the firmament and then it’s not on the outside of the Tim Allen radiation belts? Right.

I thought that was an interesting one. Yeah. And then. Yeah, and I had. I had Bart Sobrell on my show twice, and he just went on Joe Rogan. So that’s pretty cool. What was his belief in that? Bart Sobrell is the guy that got punched in the face by Buzz Aldrin. Oh, that’s awesome. Yeah. Read moon man. Great book. Eight hour. Eight hour. Listen if you want to listen to it on audible. Good book. And then final 10 to ten that freemasons are currently running the world. Three. What if this were 200 years ago? Would it still be a three? Yeah, I think there’s probably some influence, but not.

Not omnipotent. You passed. You passed the test. You passed the litmus test. We’re not going to kick you out yet. And I know that you. Deborah gets red Pill podcast is basically like. You’ve put a period at the end of that sentence. Is there any other projects that I can link to or anything else that you want to get out there? Does someone wants to convert to orthodoxy? Are you open for a evangelism on demand? I’m interested. I’m open to telling people about my experiences. I’m not interested in debating or talking theology with anybody because I’m not equipped to do it.

You have a new podcast or anything coming out? I am definitely open to doing something in the future. I’m really enjoying the freedom of not having something hanging over my head a couple times a week anymore. If I did anything in the future, it would be all just purely parapolitical and I would be much more anonymous this time around. So if anybody out there is looking for something like that, I would love to do something with someone who I don’t have to bring along for the ride as much anymore. It was very, very stressful for me to have to conduct an interview, do research, and then kind of like, hold, hold Deborah’s hand through it, too.

And I was putting more pressure on myself than I probably needed to, but that’s kind of like, what burnt me out in the long run. Who do you think Debra is voting for in the upcoming election? I think it probably, you know, just be the Democrat, whoever they wheel out. That’s not RFK. I could probably convince her to vote for RFK. She would never vote for Trump. And, yeah, I think. What would it take? What’s her ultimate sticking point with, with Trump? Dude, I asked her some crazy stuff like, like if, if somebody, you know, if Joe Biden was convicted of pedophilia, would you vote for him or Trump? And it was, it was still him.

Well, as it should be. I mean, you don’t want the orange man bad in office. You can. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, definitely, yeah. So, you know, great lady, consider it a success or a failure, or is it not in those, those confines? I mean, it was successful to a certain extent, but not to the point where I created some, like, philosophically perfect deep thinker who was able to retain enough knowledge to progress at the level that I wanted to. And it’s so did, in a strange analogy here, but did Deborah spit the red pill back up or did she fully integrate it and then pull what’s the guy’s name? Cyrus from the matrix, where he’s like, cyrus virus, not real, but I want the steak.

Ignorance is bliss. Yeah, I’d say that much. I think she knows that there’s funny business all around. Like I said, I don’t think she has the ability to retain enough knowledge from everything I hose blasted her with to, like, you know, be able to recall anything. But, you know, I think I got her off CNN and for a little bit, I guarantee she’s still back on there. I can’t blame her because I still have my warm, fuzzy version of CNN that I listen to, you know, to get my confirmation bias and stuff like that. But what’s your warm, fuzzy version of CNN? I mean, I still listen to Dave Smith.

Everyone needs a blanket. Yeah, it’s not bad to have a comfort blanket. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, um. Yeah, I mean, I’m glad I got to do the show. It was a definite, um, it was a. It was two or three years of my life, you know, of one of the main things of my life. And we had some incredible shows. We had some really, really bad ones that I wasn’t happy with. I wasn’t overall wasn’t happy with the quality of the show a lot of the time. But we had some stuff that, you know, I’ve gotten some messages from people who said, you know, your show wasn’t like the in depth, hard hitting, you know, conspiracy show that, that I listened to for other people or parapolitics or stuff like that.

But it was just really nice to be able to, like, read between the lines. And I think we gave people an outlet who weren’t able to talk to their families during the, you know, the past four years about all the craziness going on. And I think that was cathartic for some people. So I’m, I’m really happy that I was able to do that 100%, man. Honestly, that’s, that was my favorite part of the whole premise is that, like, Deborah’s not my mother in law, but she definitely acted as, like, a proxy for that person that’s in my family.

So hearing you and hearing her responses to stuff, it was cathartic. It was like, I’m never going to bring this up to that, and at thanksgiving, but, like, I loved that someone was doing it and I could almost, like, live through that experience. Anyways, one of my favorite podcasts of all time. I highly recommend that people go back and listen to the episodes while they’re still up there. I thought. And it’s a fascinating journey, too, because when you started, there was, like, the transition of, like, you went and bought new property, you moved out. You were like, you know, constantly doing construction, running into all the snags.

Like, I felt like I also got to vicariously live through you doing the homestead thing, and I can just keep being, like, a shitty city slicker. I’ve already. I’ve already got the experience through you. I appreciate that. I’m glad I could provide that for you. Thomas, thank you so much for having me on, man. I’m going to continue supporting you any way that I can. And, yeah, just thanks for everything you’ve done, and thanks for being on my show way back in the day, man. It was so cool. We did. Maybe I’ll rerelease it for some reason only, like, the last hundred shows are coming up on the.

If you look my show up, I might. I did see that. Yeah, it starts at, like, exactly 100, and that’s it. I might. I’ll try to talk to my podcast carrier and see if I can get them re released, but I had some some, like, some son of Sam stuff I want to rerelease. That’d be cool to redo yours. I think I had you on twice. I think the first time you came on with my friend Dean and we talked about colonial, dignitad, and mkultra, it was like, yeah, man, that was, like, it might have been one of the longest podcast I did.

And I remember, like, my. My computer crashed during it, and, like, I couldn’t figure out it was before I had done any editing or anything like that. I didn’t have intro music or anything on the show at that time. And so, like, there’s, like, 45 minutes of dead air at the end of the podcast. And, uh, luckily, it downloaded and saved because it was, like, one of those ones were like, this is an insane conversation, and if I lose it, I was, like, gutted, man. So maybe I’ll start putting some. Some out again, just to know before I even knew what to self censor.

So that one was. Probably went right off the rails immediately. Yeah. Yeah. But. But, uh. Yeah, man. Um. I’m really glad that we’re. We’re friends and we’re in contact, and I’d love to help you out anyway I can. So let me know. Awesome, man. Thanks again for coming by. Lifelong friends, man. I appreciate you. You’re one of the coolest people that I know, so thanks for just being you, brother. Right on. Thank you, man. Appreciate it. All right, I’ll meet you at the docks at Wednesday after eight. Okay, cool. That’s pulse. Ready for a cosmic conspiracy about Stanley kubrick, moon landings, and the CIA.

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Somewhat of an amazing feel. When it’s real to real, you will engage it. Your favorite, of course, the lord of an arrangement. I gave you the proper results to hit the pavement if they get emotional hate maybe your language a game how they play? Playing it well without lakers evading whatever the course they are to shapeshift snakes get decapitated meta is the apex executioner flame you out nuclear bomb distributed at war rather gruesome for eyes to see maxim out then I light my trees, blow it off in the face? You’re despising me for what though? Calculated and rather cutthroat.

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