Video Summary
Summary
➡ The Paranoid American podcast, launched in 2012, has been dedicated to unearthing hidden secrets of our society like MKUltra mind control, secret societies, forbidden technology, and occult symbols. The latest episode features guest Mystic Mark from "My Family Thinks I'm Crazy" podcast and operator of Alt Media United, a cooperative for alternative media podcasters. Their discussion centers on the origins and evolution of Paranoid American and the exploration of secret societies like Skull and Bones.
➡ The speaker's journey began as a delivery driver, finding oddities in his city and listening to podcasts during his work hours. This curiosity led him to begin exploring conspiracy theories and eventually introduced him to Sam Tripoli, who later gave him the opportunity to forward his interests more actively. Unsatisfied with his delivery job at Amazon, the speaker decided to dive headfirst into podcasting, resulting in the establishment of his own podcast "My Family Thinks I'm Crazy". His mission now is to elevate the genre of alternative research or conspiracy theory, which is often overlooked in the podcasting world.
➡ The speaker expresses skepticism about the commonly accepted history of Native Americans, questioning the roles and impacts of different cultures before Columbus. They further extend their skepticism to the existence of dinosaurs, believing that academia may have manipulated the truth to serve certain agendas. They suggest a potential connection between certain extinct creatures and mythical beings referenced in religious texts.
➡ The text revolved around discussing various theories including dinosaurs, flat earth and mud flood. The conversation ended smoothly by promoting paranoidamerican.com's homunculus owner's manual and thanking Sam Tripoli for generating employment within the conspiracy theory world.
➡ The speaker discusses the concept of Alt Media United, a cooperative for independent podcasters to connect, collaborate, and elevate the genre of conspiracy alternative podcasts. He emphasizes the power of unity among podcasters in face of competition and underscores the need for authenticity, audience interaction, and avoiding disparagement of other podcasts.
➡ The text discusses the fairness of podcast rankings, manipulation of download numbers through bots, and a trick for cheapening purchases by disguising product barcodes. It also delves into the possible negative impacts of self-checkouts like job loss and increasing automation which might exclude some consumers based on perceived risk. Lastly, it highlights the personal freedom that podcasting can offer.
➡ The narrator reflects on their growth and understanding of their local area and its connection to their personal identity. They express disappointment in the initial emotional manipulation they experienced following the 9/11 attacks, and discuss their journey of challenging the predominant narratives leading them towards conspiracy theories. They also remembered their early ambition to join the military and their later realization of having fallen for wartime propaganda.
➡ Mystic Mark enjoys the idea of being a police officer, despite recognizing corruption within the system. His views have evolved from anti-police sentiments due to events like Occupy Wall Street, to appreciating law and order. He acknowledges that perspective and viewpoints can change, and stresses the importance of remaining flexible and open to better reasoning, even if such changes might lead to disagreement from followers.
➡ The text covers a conversation where individuals rate their beliefs on various conspiracy theories, myths, or unknown phenomena. Simultaneously, they discuss the ambiguity of understanding good and evil, and the phenomenon of demons, suggesting that cultural context and personal behavior significantly influence one's encounters with positive or negative energies.
➡ The text discusses the potentially negative influence of occultist Aleister Crowley's work and the speaker's own personal encounters with its strange energy. The speaker argues that Crowley's autobiography and poetry, which includes questionable content, may draw certain individuals into a dark and harmful realm. Despite the lack of concrete evidence about Crowley's alleged crimes, his writings continue to resonate today due to his controversial publicity stunts, self-proclaimed wickedness, and disruptive impact on various secret societies.
➡ The text discusses the influence of Aleister Crowley, attributing his popularity to his persona being taken up by pop culture figures, like rock and roll musicians, and suggests that his ideas resonated with the counterculture of the era. Moreover, it covers how secret societies, the occult, and trends in culture have evolved over time, from 1800s seances to contemporary music and celebrity obsession. It also suggests the pharmaceutical industry's role in downplaying holistic or natural cures, contributing to a chemically-dependent society. Lastly, it asserts the idea that publicity and narcissism became pivotal parts of both Crowley's image and modern celebrity culture.
➡ The speaker discusses the concept of stardom, suggesting it has origins in Greek or Roman pantheon-like entities, and evolved into a tool for monetary gain, evidenced by figures like Elvis, The Beatles, Marilyn Monroe, and more. They discuss the rise of individuals as personal 'stars', emphasizing on Joe Rogan's authenticity and the audiences' desire for genuine content. They also touch on secret societies, psychological warfare, and the idea of awakening amidst corporate manipulation. The conversation transitions into the potential for celebrities selling their souls for fame, illuminating illusions through comedic impressions, and the importance of a straight man in comedy. The speaker expresses frustration with repeated references to the Tartaria conspiracy theory and argues for the credibility of historical records in their hometown. They end considering the possibility of historical structures being claimed rather than built by certain societies.
Video Transcription
Summary
Video TranscriptionGood evening, listeners. Brave navigators of the enigmatic and the concealed. Have you ever felt the pull of the unanswered, the allure of the mysteries that shroud our existence? For more than a decade, a unique comic publisher has dared to dive into these mysteries, unafraid of the secrets they might uncover. This audacious entity is paranoid American. Welcome to the mystifying universe of the paranoid American podcast. Launched in the year 2012, paranoid American has been on a mission to decipher the encrypted secrets of our world.
From the unnerving enigma of MKUltra mind control to the clandestine assemblies of secret societies, from the aweinspiring frontiers of forbidden technology to the arcane patterns of occult symbols in our very own pop culture, they have committed to unveiling the concealed realities that lie just beneath the surface. Join us as we navigate these intricate landscapes, decoding the hidden scripts of our society, and challenging the accepted perceptions of reality.
Folks, I've got a big problem on my hands. There's a company called Paranoid American making all these funny memes and comics. Now, I'm a fair guy. I believe in free speech as long as it doesn't cross the line. And if these AI generated memes dare to make fun of me, they're crossing the line. This is your expedition into the realm of the extraordinary, the secret, the shrouded. Come with us as we sift through the world's grand mysteries, question the standardized narratives, and brave the cryptic labyrinth of the concealed truth.
So strap yourselves in, broaden your horizons, and steal yourselves for a voyage into the enigmatic heart of the Paranoid American podcast, where each story, every image, every revelation brings us one step closer to the elusive truth. Episode number nine. We're almost in the double digits. And tonight I've got a good friend, someone that I've known for a while, a few years at least. And that is the one, the only, the majestic, the mystic mark.
What up, Mark? What's up? I love how your whole setup is concocted. You're like a video editing wizard. You had me appear through the window for the audio listeners, if there is any yet. Yep, there I am in the window. I love it. I'm like the Peeping Tom on this podcast, but I just want to point out how freaking sick your video intro is. I mean, that's probably the best intro to any podcast I've ever seen.
Kudos. That's high praise. That's high praise from you, especially since you're the podcast guy, right? I could probably have you sit here and just list, like, 100 podcasts off the top of your head, and that wouldn't even be all of them. I might be able to do that, but I will say it's impressive. I was sitting here thinking, all right, how much do I need to pay Thomas to get me one of those? Basically? But, hey, you got your own style.
I love it. This is so cool. And 2012 is when Paranoid American started I didn't know that. And I'm glad the intro mentioned it because that's around the same time I kind of got into all this stuff. That's when I graduated from high school, actually, it was 2012. So I don't know what that says about my generation, but it definitely felt apocalyptic, to say the least. But we're already rolling here in the intro.
Let me stop interrupting you and let you get on that's nuts, because actually, I started in 2006, if I'm being honest. But I didn't get serious, and I couldn't get any of my comics published. So in 2012, I said, I'm going to stop trying to reach out to other publishers who keep laughing at me or thinking I'm insane or thinking I'm like, a crazy and just do it myself.
But this isn't about me. This is about Mystic Mark. And as a quick introduction, My Family Thinks I'm Crazy is an incredibly entertaining podcast, all kinds of interesting guests constantly. You also have you're the guy, you know everybody in the community, because I think you also run Alt Media United, which is kind of this big. I don't want to call it a conglomeration because it sounds a little too corporate, but it's like a huge cooperative of sort of alt Media podcasters, hence the name.
So I wanted to let you describe my family thinks I'm crazy. Describe Mystic Mark and describe Alt Media United a little bit. Yeah. Well, thanks, Thomas. I appreciate you inviting me. Here a little look behind the scenes. You actually reached out to me probably when I was only 50 episodes in. It was possibly after I did Sam Tripoli's Tinfoil Hat podcast. Maybe that was where you first heard of me, or maybe it was Idiocalypse or the shows I was doing with Alex Stein back then.
But you did reach out to me, and we've been in touch since then. And I'm really grateful to have met you because not only have you come through multiple times, delivered very interesting podcasts, not only on my show, but on other shows I've booked you on, but you've provided me with some really incredible materials that I've been able to share with my audience. The Skull and Bones comic book, the MKUltra pamphlets, and a number of really interesting stickers.
So. Yeah. Geronimo's grave. It's so funny how that kind of synchronistically connected us, because for me, Geronimo and Skull and Bones, that's something like a local legend growing up where I'm from. And it took me till after high school to learn about all this stuff. Although I was interested in conspiracies, I didn't quite understand the reality of it. And it was one day in New Haven where I met a gentleman named Amos who taught me all about Skull and Bones and how they had robbed Geronimo's grave.
And sure enough, however many years later, ten years later, I meet you, and you've published a comic book literally portraying the whole incident. And I've actually taken one of those comic books and folded it the way, like, the Jehovah's Witness will leave something in the seal of your door. I took one of those comic books and I put it in between the two doors of the Skull and Bones tomb.
So I don't know who found that, but fingers crossed. Maybe that's a part of their little memorabilia now. Or maybe they have it on display. Maybe they threw it in the trash. Who knows? But yeah, Skull and Bones, that's a subject that I've been maybe that's why I can't fly on planes anymore. Oh, God. Yeah. I put you on their watch list. I'm sorry. I didn't think about that.
I'm like, oh, shit, that has Thomas's name in it and all that. Hopefully I ripped the back cover out so there was no it's such a common name. So many people have the last name. It's it's very typical. Well, if that is your gnome deplore, you picked a very good one because that's vague and maybe we'll never know Thomas's real name, but that's funny you say that because I remember the first time you were on my podcast, episode 44.
I'm pretty sure we just called you the Paranoid American. I don't know if we even said your full name, but yeah, either way, that's a long way of going about explaining that. I've been interested in this stuff for a long time, and there was a number of synchronicities that occurred during a delivery job that I had in New Haven that really pushed me into I don't know. It's funny because now I think about it a little differently, but then it was all very exciting, like, wow, this is so marvelous that I have this opportunity to be, like, an know journalist or detective or whatever you want to call it at Yale University because it is such an insulated place.
If you're not a student there, you can't just wander through the buildings. You might be able to go in the library, you might be able to walk around campus a bit. But as an outsider in a place that felt like it was a part of where, you know, it's like, hey, why can't I explore this magnificent place? And having a job at this bakery allowed me to do that.
And I found myself in all these different buildings within the Yale campus. I even went inside of the former lodge where the wolfshead Secret Society met. They have a new building now, but I was in their former building. And on the day George H. W. Bush died, I realized that every Tuesday I had been delivering pastries in his former home. And I realized that because I looked down at the newspaper and it said, george H.
W. Bush died today. And it said, former resident of New Haven, 88 Hill House Avenue. And that was the same address of the building I was standing in as I read that. So, I mean, there was a number of synchronicities like that that just kind of smacked me across the face. But it was so funny because that pastry spot in particular where we would deliver pastries to, it wasn't like a cafe or anything.
A lot of my deliveries were to cafes. This was to a mathematics or economics department. And they wanted, like, coffee and pastries delivered for their staff every Tuesday morning. And the janitor was so fed up with having to let me in while he was vacuuming because I would bang on the door, let me in. So he taught me how to break into this building. So every Tuesday, I would hop a wall, go around to the front, open it up, put the pastries in, and leave.
And sure enough, I find out some months later that I had been doing this in the home where George H. W. Bush and George Bush, Jr. Were living when they lived in New Haven. Like this was one of George W. Bush's childhood that's you were jumping the just like and I thought to myself, jeez, I wonder how many times they sat and ate in this courtyard here that I was, like, jumping a wall to get, you know, number of synchronicities like that.
Seeing weird things like people going in and out of the secret society buildings. People going in and out of what looked like tunnels. Hearing rumors of homeless people falling into tunnels and never coming back. I mean, there's a lot of weird things going on in New Haven, and I started to become very fascinated. And luckily for me, being a delivery driver, I had tons of time to listen to podcasts.
And I gravitated towards Sam, Tripoli's, Tinfoil Hat, the Higher Side, chats Grammarica show, among others. And I went to go see Sam Tripoli in New York City. I gave him a copy of the Caballion, which is the seven hermetic principles. And that just kind of was a key into this other realm. Like, giving him that book unlocked this kind of podcast for me, or at least the possibility of it.
Not that it wasn't possible before, but I really think of that as a turning point because I had a conversation with Sam very briefly. I gave him the book. I gave him this interesting pouch made out of faraday fabric, and he was just like, know. And that got me a chance to go on his podcast sometime after. You know, I'd always had a knack for this kind of stuff, and I'd always kind of talked about weird conspiracy theories with my friends.
And I think Sam kind of picked that up in me, and he noticed that in me. And he asked me to do a spot on his new spiritual podcast called Zero. So I joined him. I told him about my thoughts on spirituality and synchronicity and how that had guided me through my life up until that point. And still to this day. And it was weird. He says, oh, I don't know who I'm going to have next on this podcast.
Who do you think I should have next on this podcast? And I'm like, oh, I'll email you. I emailed him a list like 20 names long. And he's like, hey, maybe I should hire you to do this for me part time. And if you're good at it, I'll have you do it full time because I'm getting busier and busier. It's harder and harder to book guests for all these shows I'm doing.
So one thing led to another, and I ended up working really closely with, you know, now I just went and saw him this past weekend. He did a show out here where I live in Connecticut. Got to meet Eddie, Bravo and Xavier for the first time, which was cool. But all of that was, again, so synchronistic. Like, wow, what are the ODS that Sam asked me to do that.
And I had had a podcast at that time called The Bud Triangle, which the concept was that me and my two friends, the three of us, were sitting in a triangle smoking bud. And I told them about conspiracies. Because you got to think about it, in 2018, 2017, a lot of people were still in that old mindset of like, no conspiracies. That's stuff you see in movies, that's stuff you see in comic books, that's stuff you see in video games, but it doesn't really happen in real life.
Sure, there's Internet rumors about it, but it doesn't really happen in real life. But with Trump, people started to actually consider it because they saw weird shit going on. Trump was saying weird shit, QAnon, like, things that a president had never said before, things that had never happened on that stage before were happening. So I saw that as an opportunity to get my friends in on this and talk to them about it.
And I was obsessed with podcasts. I was like, I need to start a podcast. But then I eventually gave that name up, the Bud Triangle. Because I told my family, I'm like, hey, I'm going to quit my job. And they are so excited at this point that I was an Amazon delivery driver. Because back then too, Amazon was like, billion dollar company. You can make $18 an hour working for Amazon.
Come on, change your life. Like, I was one of those guys that got into their scheme because they hired like, hundreds of people in that time period that I got hired at Amazon. So I started delivering packages at Amazon. My family's stoked. They're like, oh, wow, he's finally got, like, a job that seems good. And then I turn to him. I'm telling him I'm going to quit to work for some guy who lives in Los Angeles.
And they're scratching their head like, how is that a good thing? Talking about the world's in a pandemic, right? You that's stupid. And truthfully, I was fed up with my job because they were doing the stupid laser test every time we got into the building to see if we were sick and made us wear masks as we're moving all this heavy stuff around. So I was fed up.
I quit that job, and I said, fuck it. I have this opportunity with Sam. I'm going to dive headfirst. I'm going to start my own podcast, and my family thinks I'm crazy. That phrase hit me when I told my family about my new decision. So I'm like, oh, shit. My family thinks I'm crazy. And I'm thinking about that, and I'm like, oh, that's a name of a podcast.
That's my podcast name. And I told Sam and he said, oh, yeah, that sounds cool. And that's how it all started. I mean, I've come a long way since started off just doing it, literally sitting down with my friend in a room around a microphone. And now I have a RODECaster and a Rode mic and a nice laptop. And that's all, really, thanks to Sam Tripoli and the people that tuned into my show early on.
Sure, I was lucky to get onto his platform and be exposed to more people than I would have if I just started off by myself on my own. But I think the synchronicity had to happen. And that's just how my life works, and I think there's a science to it. I might not have figured it out totally, but I think something in me knew when I was young, you can quit college because this is going to work out for you if you stick with what you like, if you do what you like.
And I'd been really into the law of attraction stuff around that time, too. And plus, I had some friends who told me that I would get my student loan debt forgiven. They're like, oh, yeah, I know this thing. You write these papers and you get your student loan debt forgive. You just got to vote for Bernie. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that was part of it too, I'm sure. And that never happened.
I ended up paying my student loan debt off, but luckily, I only had about a year and a half of debt to pay. So all that aside, I really believe in that entrepreneurial sort of spirit, taking the opportunities that are in front of you and bending them into a better one. That's kind of what I did with the delivery jobs. I took that as an opportunity to get paid, to learn.
And I just listened to so many podcasts that by the time I had an opportunity to do a podcast, I was so ready because I had heard what everyone else was talking about. I knew who I wanted to talk to on the podcast. And I still haven't even come close to hitting, like, 50% of that list of people that I initially set out to interview because there's tons of people that have inspired me on my bookshelf here, so many interesting authors that I want to talk to on my show.
So I appreciate you saying that. Up at the top, you said, I interview some really interesting people. That means a lot to me because I do try to have some standard for who I let on the show. And yeah, Alt Media United is kind of like the realization that nobody is trying to elevate this genre. As far as Spotify, Apple, like, the podcast aggregators, they're not going to ever create a genre called conspiracy theory or alternative research, right? You're just not going to see that.
You got history, you got philosophy, you got comedy, you got the main genres, and that's it. So I thought, why don't we have a website where everybody could just put their podcast? And if people want to hear more interesting conspiracy alternative podcasts, they could go there to learn about new ones. If they hear about Tinfoil Hat or they hear about my show, and then they go and find Alt Media United and they say, oh, Tinfoil Hat is connected to all these other shows in a way.
And albeit the only thing that connects us is that we're doing these shows independently. Nobody in the cooperative is a part of some giant podcast corporation. It's not like we have one of those generic podcasts that you hear that always make it curiously into the top ten, top 20. That's the kind of stuff that we're up against. And I feel like Alt Media United, the reason we're cooperative is because if we cooperate with one another, we can all elevate this genre of entertainment to a professional level where people who are good at it can make money and work with each other, rely on each know.
And that was motivated in part a big way by Sam Tripoli and all the philosophy he sort know, he kind of generated surrounding the podcast like Tinfoil Hat and Union of the Unwanted, like that whole ethos of, like, we could do this together. Yeah, the algorithm doesn't want us. Yeah, they're censoring us. Yeah, they're suppressing us. But at the end of the day, if we band together, they can't stop us.
And you see it now where I think most people are fairly awake to the issues that are most important to us. I mean, yes, there are distractions, yes, there's division and diversions and all this other propagandized crap. But I think for the most part, thanks to the know, we are waking up at an unprecedented level. And I don't think that it's an accident that there are so many conspiracy.
Like me and Juan sometimes will talk shit to each other, like, oh, your podcast is and my podcast, blah, blah, blah, because we like the competitive rap battle. We like the faux competitiveness because that's just how we are geared. But in all reality, I've helped Juan out a lot. He's helped me out a lot. We've both made our audience aware of each other. So now Sam tripoli, I heard Juan being talked about on Broken SIM today with Johnny.
And, you know, and I think that's awesome to hear that I'm not like, oh, they should be talking about me. I'm like, fuck yeah. Juan's, awesome. Talk about Juan. He's great. He's doing great research. So that's the kind of thing that more people need to do. And if they're listening to this right now and they're like, shit, my podcast isn't on Alt Media United. All you got to do is email me because that's as easy as it is.
It's also very email address. Let me just drop the email address. Yeah, altmediaunited@gmail. com. And yeah, it's just as easy to join as it is to get asked to leave if you don't cooperate with others. If you're talking shit about other podcasts, that's a pretty easy way for us to say, now, we're not going to have you a part of this because you're not really that cooperative. But there is a lot of beef in the podcast world, isn't there? It's kind of weird.
Well, it's at levels, it's people who fight with other podcasts. They usually fight with podcasts who have the same amount of listeners as them, you know what I mean? Or they're punching up and they're trying to take shots at somebody that maybe they're a little envious of. But yeah, like rap battles, man. It reminds me the same exact dynamics of a rap battle where you don't ever punch down because if you ever lose in that situation, you just put it all on the line for what? To punch down at someone.
And now you basically switch positions with them. So I don't know. I think that there's something really interesting with the entertainment and the competitive aspect. And man, podcasting is almost like competitive talking. It's like a sport. Yeah, it's interesting that it can feel that way. I think that's more so the case with YouTube shows and shows that are on YouTube because there's more comments and interactions with the fans and they can be sort of charged up into being really into a show because they love being in that fight mentality of like, oh yeah, f that podcast, or we love this podcast.
Do you think that there could be some online audiences that convert into cults at some point? I think that's already the case. I mean, there's definitely cult following around certain podcasts for sure. And it doesn't appear to make much sense to others who see whichever show they might not like and be like, how could anybody watch this? But then there's millions of people that do. So that's a cult in a way.
There's like an ASMR might be like a cult that's rising up and we don't even realize it. And then one day they're going to say, know a meteor is going to pass over Earth and everyone that listens to ASMR has to drink this special potion. Yeah, I'm just glad celebrities don't seem to do very well in podcasting, aside from the comedian. Celebrities who have made a really good niche out of podcasting and actually, I think brought more people to podcasting than any other genre is really comedy podcasts.
But yeah, no, I'm just glad celebrities aren't doing well in podcasting because it just shows that people are interested in authenticity and that's something that television departed from, I think, a few decades ago. And now we have the majority of people who probably are entertained more by sure streaming sites, but things like YouTube and podcasting are creeping into that percentage wise. So people I mean, me, myself, I listen to only podcasts.
I mean, barely do I sit down and watch the podcast on YouTube. It's really only I make an exception for like Kill Tony, which you got to watch it. If you only listen to it, I think you might be missing out. But with certain podcasts, it seems like, yeah, there's a huge cult following. And I like to think that I've figured out some ways to make my show really unique and I've seen success by doing that.
But I noticed that the podcasts that do well are the ones that interact a lot with their audience. Yeah, there are big exceptions to that. But I do notice that audience interaction is a big thing. So in that respect, who knows, maybe in 1020 years we'll see actual cults developing out of things that were initially just like virtual or online. I think I might hear what you've seen as audience interactions that you thought were really clever in podcast world.
Well, it's interesting because yeah, I do this for the love of it because I am interested in all these subjects. And the fact that I can actually make money doing this is a really big thing for me because that's a part of it. It's like millions, I hear like tens of millions. What do you mean that's how much you can make in the conspiracy podcast world? I mean, depends on who you're talking about.
I don't know about that. Jeez, maybe. I don't know. That's funny. It's actually you brought up a really good mean. I was kind of joking about that a little bit, but yeah, I remember back in the day when you would go to Barnes and Noble and they for sure had a paranormal occult section and it was usually tucked away or upstairs or something with a bunch of other true crime and kind of undesirable topics.
But they had the section and you could almost always guarantee you'd go up there and find someone else that was, I don't know, maybe wearing jinkos or had black nail polish or something, right. But it kind of drew people to it and you knew that that was the section that had this kind of stuff in it. And in the podcast world, it is weird that that section doesn't necessarily still exist the way that it used to in old bookshops.
I don't know. And I think that there's definitely something noble and worthwhile of trying to carve that sort of category back out society as a whole within podcasting, within everything. So it's not just relegated to this old forgotten isle of Barnes and Noble where people aren't even going to know what the hell that is pretty soon. Right, right. Well, I think Barnes and Noble knows how successful those books, how well those books do, and how there are cult followings for those books and they consistently sell.
But it is funny. You can learn a lot about the owner of a bookshop by seeing what they don't shelve because I've gone into bookshops where you get only a few conspiracy books and they're all hidden in the history section or you get some conspiracy books and they're all shoved in with the new age books. Know. Very rarely do I come across a bookshop that has a really good section on that.
But surprisingly, Barnes and Noble consistently, because it's a corporation, has a good selection of those sorts of books. So, yeah, that's a good point. But to your point, much like the section at Barnes and Noble, it's off near the bathroom or it's off in some weird corner where you wouldn't expect it. And I think the same is true with the algorithm on YouTube and even Spotify and these other podcast apps where you go and look at the top charts or what they're suggesting.
It's typically not shows like this. There are exceptions to that and shows that break through. And I think Apple that's one of their saving graces is that they are pretty honest with the charts. Like what the charts are. They're basically how many downloads the podcast is getting. You can't get any more honest than that. Right? If the podcast is doing well, it gets to number one. Then again, you do have corporations who can buy bots to go and do fake downloads on a podcast to make it look like it's doing much better than it.
And they do, but they also have been caught a few times. I remember, man, it was probably like ten years ago, sony and Universal was doing that, and they would buy up like millions of views on their YouTube videos when an artist would drop a music video, and then they find out later that it was all bots. And then the artists technically were able to sue the labels for inflating their numbers and making them think they were doing a It's a Funny World where they'll just pay because it's just a marketing cost.
Right. If I can pay is X amount. I don't know if you remember Obama and Bruce Springsteen had a podcast that ran for like ten episodes and they did. Just that they bought all these downloads, made it look like it was doing so well the first week it came out. And everybody who was reporting on it in the podcast realm was like, who the fuck heard of this podcast until a week ago? How does it have 100,000 or 200,000 downloads and it's only like, one episode? That's ridiculous.
And it just goes to show that, yeah, they can fake that kind of stuff. But for the most part, the fact that shows like Tinfoil Hat can make it into the top 200 and stay there for as long as they have a shows how popular a show like that is, but also shows that they're not suppressing anything in those algorithms yet. So, yeah, I think that's shout out to Nick Natoli, too, who had the Boycott Target song at the top of the charts for a while.
I was shocked that they didn't suppress that one. Put it in like a special category that you had to opt in to even see. Yeah, Sam is friends with that guy, and I don't know, I think that's his cousin or something. It's weird, but I heard about that through Sam and I still haven't heard that song. I go to Target to buy action figures, so maybe I'm revealing too much about oh, no, you haven't boycotted Target.
Do you pick up the Bud Light case on the way out, too? Well, blur my face for this, but I have been known to take advantage of those self checkout. If anybody wants a scam to scam Target, all you got to do is just rip the barcode off of a cheaper product. Like, let's say you go to the grocery aisle and you take the barcode off of a gatorade, one of those little gatorade things, the sport mixers, the drink mixes, just rip the barcode off of this, like $3.
You put that over the barcode of whatever you want, and then you ring it out and it looks like you're ringing out what you want, throw it in the bag, and you're only charging yourself $3. So maybe I'm a little bit of a scumbag for that. But hey, we're boycotting Target. So scam that target. There is an element of risk in there because I may or may not have myself been arrested specifically from Target for trying that same exact thing in the they brought me back into or allegedly, they brought my friend back into the security booth or whatever.
And again, this is like 97, 98, and they've got cameras on each of the aisles. And as the cashier would ring it up, it would show you on the security camera. Here's the thing that just got rung up. So sometimes if you could see someone checking out a TV and it's like, here's your gallon of water, it makes it really obvious. So just as a counterpoint there be extra careful.
But yeah, I highly recommend and in fact, this episode is sponsored by Stealing from Target. So if you want to support this episode and you want to support Mystic Mark, you can support us by going and stealing something from Target. Yeah, well, you could also support my podcast so I don't have to steal from Target, but I'm actually doing it out of choice, allegedly, to fight back against these automated self checkout things that are causing less jobs in the economy, leading to more homelessness.
I mean, it's a trickle down effect. Allah, Ronald Reagan. The more self checkout machines there are, the less jobs there are. It's just a fact. So although I do use the self checkout at Whole Foods because I don't like waiting in line, I boycott every other self checkout by either stealing from it or not using it. So eventually they're either going to have to give up on the self checkout or turn every store into basically like a food or item prison where you have to have a gatekeeper unlock everything for you or some kind of code where you put your credit card on and it automatically charges you to open it and take it.
I think that's where we're going to get to. I can't remember what those were called, but that was like a huge thing in the early 19 hundreds. You would go into these big room and all this food would be behind these little glasses, like little lockers, and you would buy a key to open it out and take I forgot what they were called. You can do that in Japan.
Those are very popular in Japan where it's like a vending machine store and everything's behind a vending machine. And you just walk in and slide your card and say, a, B, seven, T, seven, pick out, and it just falls. But jeez, we've really gone down a tangent here. Well, I think it's interesting just because and you were just saying that the self checkout at Whole Foods, but man, isn't Whole Foods owned by Amazon? So you're right back in the belly of the beast at that point.
And their next step is to one up the self checkout and just make it. So you walk over and grab an apple off the shelf and it's just like Mark now has one apple and you don't need to tell anyone. It just knows that you've got the apple. So, I mean, I don't think there's any use fighting that. I think the only thing that's going to happen is they're going to keep weeding out people that they deem as risks.
So then you're going to go to get that apple and the door is not going to open for Mark and it's just going to a there's a chance based on your hat and your shoes and the way that your gate, that we're just going to say, no thanks, go find another shop to purchase from. Yeah, well, I think that's where we may be heading. And if that's the case, then I'm just going to do everything, like on pickup or delivery basis where someone else can shop for me and then just send the groceries to my house.
Yeah, I don't want to be in that cart. Yeah, but hey, this is the electronic world we're heading to. I feel like it's ironic because the podcast, it's gotten me enmeshed in many ways in the system, so to speak. Like the Internet system and using the Internet, my face, my likeness, and all this stuff is on public display on the Internet. But at the same time, my actual life, I mean, I'm freer than ever.
I don't have a boss. Technically, I work for Sam, but he's not much of a boss. He's a friend more than he's a yeah. Yeah, I think that's the blessing. I really appreciate people for allowing me to take this journey by supporting the podcast, because that's the biggest thing I gleamed from podcasting, was how I could free myself from this BS system that I felt like was just oppressing me and leaving me depressed.
Not to say that my life wasn't fun or interesting or good. I really enjoy life, for sure, but working every day was just not my thing. Whose thing is it? I'd rather be working on a farm. I've done that before. That's fulfilling, right? But the work I was doing previous to driving was not really fulfilling. Driving was great, but at the end of the day, this takes the cake.
I mean, I'm sitting here talking to friends like you and learning about all this stuff, researching it. This is what I think I was destined to do in some way. And I think the way I can give back is by learning about my local area and trying to really figure out what's going on around here, because this is where it started for me, and I found a lot of people are inspired by that.
And luckily for them, it leads them to their own synchronicities by taking a newfound appreciation from where they're from, the land, the history, these stories start to pull you in, and next thing you know, you become a part of the story. I think that's what's so cool about researching this stuff, particularly when it connects to where you're from or where you live, your family, your ancestry, and all those threads that make us a unique person.
You mentioned in 2012, you were basically just getting out of high school, or you were in high school. I'm curious. You don't have to say your exact age, but I'm assuming you were fairly young when 911 happened. What was your initial reaction to 911 when it first happened? And I'm curious, when was your first big conspiracy moment when you were like, Illuminati is real, skull and Bones is real? 911 was an inside job.
So I'm 28. I'll be 29 in October. So I was like seven years old. When 911 happened, and I was in second or third grade, and they told us that class was over and we had to go into the library, and we went to the library and we watched the news as a group, and then we went home and it was really weird. And I'm sure that's a familiar story to anyone my age within, like, five or ten years.
Because yeah, I've heard that other people say that where they were in school because it was a Tuesday and the classes were closed and they made everybody go into an auditorium or a library or whatever to watch the news, which I thought was interesting in hindsight. Like, well, if the nation's at war now because there was just an attack, why are you going to expose all the kids to that? Don't you want these kids to go home and feel at least somewhat comfortable and not like there's about to be a dangerous war and we all might die? It didn't seem logical at that age.
So that never sat right with me. So then I became pretty patriotic, like, oh yeah, we got to fight these Iraqis and we got to work. The programming worked. Yeah, exactly. We got to find Osama bin Laden. And I remember watching Fox News with my parents, or Christmas, like 2001, that Christmas, my parents were glued to the TV because all the soldiers were going off. This was like peak O'Reilly years too, right? Soldiers were going off to Iraq or whatever.
I don't remember exactly the specific circumstances, but they were interviewing soldiers who were in the Middle East and always a big deal because it was Christmas and they weren't going to be home for the holidays because now we're in this big war. So I was pretty sympathetic to that cause, and I just thought about it over the years as I got older, and I started to realize, like, oh, my grandparents and my father and these people that watch the news and repeat these talking points and this rhetoric, this isn't their own thoughts.
They're not actually thinking these things through because when I started to have a little the smallest whiff of dissent, I was immediately smashed for my contrary opinion. So that was a big red flag for me as a young, inquisitive, curious person, because I'm like, is this within your family or within your school or everything? Anything? I'm not really speaking to a specific circumstance, but I remember having conversations with my grandfather, my mother, my father, anybody that I was near the news around.
Or sometimes you'd be at a gas station, you'd hear people overhear someone having a conversation like, oh yeah, we need to kill all these brown people. I live in Connecticut. It's a blue state as far as voting goes, but there's tons of Republicans here, and tons of people, despite political allegiance, felt that way during that time. So to me it felt like, oh, these people aren't really thinking for themselves.
They're sort of just getting emotionally agitated. And that's where a lot of this is coming from because they would just get really upset. I think it was like family parties, uncles, or I'd hear people have these conversations about that and I'd be like, well, I just raised a contrary point of view. And that would just get people upset. And I remember really regretting having so much fervor around, like, oh, yeah, we need to get Osama bin Laden.
Because I was what? As I got older, like 2006, seven came around, I think around then, I was in middle school and I watched Loose Change, which was a documentary about 911 that came out, was edited a number of times. And it's funny, I actually interviewed Jason Burmis, who, although he wasn't the only person part of it, he claims that he basically made the best version of Loose Change.
So, I don't know. I've heard similar from I think his name's Dylan Avery. I went to school with him when I was in elementary school in upstate New York. Yeah. Wow. Isn't that crazy? Another synchronicity. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. I don't know exactly who the people were, but they were fairly young. I remember hearing their voices on the documentary and thinking like, oh, these are people my age doing it.
Was that and then Zeitgeist, too. That was the other big one. Around that same time. Yeah. This girl that I sat next to in math class, I had a crush on her, and I think she might have liked me back because she suggested that I watched Zeitgeist. I always remembered, oh, that's awesome. That would be like, love it. At first sight of someone, if like, oh, you should check out Zeitgeist.
It's like one of those memes, I had no game back then, but that certainly was a good sign. If I had game, I should have followed up with that. But no giving her one of those 911, I'm falling for you cards, and she probably would have dug it. I've never heard of that, but I might know, add those to the shop soon. Oh, cool. So, yeah, all that to say, it kind of dawned on me afterwards that there was a lot of wartime propaganda that I fell for.
And I got into martial arts, and for a moment when I was a kid, I was into military stuff. I thought I would join the military. I had, like, Airsoft guns and I printed out, like, Osama bin Laden targets out of my grandparents printer. And you were going to karate chop the shit out of him, weren't you? No, I wasn't doing karate chops. I was doing, like, sniper practice with my Airsoft paper.
You took martial arts too, right? But yeah, I would try to chop pieces of wood and dumb shit like that. But eventually I had, like, a heavy bag that I hung from a tree in my backyard. But that was much later, after well into, because Obama was in office for me through high school. I think around high school, he got elected. Did the school celebrate that? At meant to.
We were made to watch that, too. His inauguration, which we weren't ever made to watch. Bush's inauguration in school, well, this was historic. It was the first president of color in history, right? And also allegedly the first gay president, too. But we don't have not the first CIA president, though. Well, he might not be the first gay president, now that I say that. I mean, jeez the people in this 1718 hundreds.
It's a spectrum, man. It's a spectrum. What are you going to do? You throw a dart? We might have another gay president if Joe Biden runs again. But anyways oh, wait, he is the president. So anyways, what were we talking about? Well, actually, this is the perfect time to segue into some rapid fire questions, but I want to start it out with one very important question, and there is a right answer to this one.
It's not a trick question. Mystic Mark, are you a cop? Because if you're a cop, you have to tell me. Would a cop smoke his are you a cop? I do on a podcast. That could be fake weed. I don't know. No, I'm pretty sure it's not fake weed. I think you've got the good shit. If I was a cop, wouldn't I say right away that I'm not a cop? Are you trying to play some double reverse psychology on me, sir? That's something that a cop might do.
Just saying. If I was a cop, this podcast would be a pretty good cover if I was trying to investigate some sort of podcast drug ring or something like that. The online waco. Yeah, start shipping people defunct grenade shells. That would be a really poor decision on the part of whatever department hired me to send me in as a mole for Sam Tripoli's podcast. If I was trying to get in with anybody, I think Sam Tripoli is not the way to do it.
I love Sam. Sam's amazing. But he has exposed his intentions and his beliefs enough to where yeah, there's no moles in the tinfoil hat podcast. But no, I'm not a cop. If I was, let the record show that Mystic Mark declared he is not a cop 805 Eastern. But I have ideas of being a cop. That would be fun. I mean, not that I believe in police. I do believe there's a lot of corruption in police forces, and I would like to see an end to know.
I live in a blue state on the East Coast, so there's a lot of bullshit that goes on. And sometimes I'm like, if I was a cop right now, I'd be pulling that motherfucker over, or whatever the case may be. Sometimes I'm like, yeah, I wish I was a cop right now. My girlfriend makes fun of me because she's like, oh, you're such a do good or you're such a rule follower.
And I'm like, what are you talking about? I don't have a real job, I'm basically out of the system. What are you talking about? But no, I like cops. I'm not a cop though. Well, I don't know a rule follower is the right way to describe it. But even as you were saying a little bit earlier, that the way that the school kind of showed you the 911, right? And you were thinking later that logically didn't make sense to you and you could never really resolve it.
And that sort of added to that feeling of deception or some kind of manipulation, I assume. And I think that might be part of that same facet. Right. It's not that you need rules, but that you think in logical terms of like action, consequence, what actually makes sense for all of these things to happen. So sometimes that can be sort of misconstrued as being a rule follower, but really it's more like having a comfort, having a system to work by that things don't just arbitrarily change and get subjective.
Yeah, I agree with that. I've always been very scientifically minded. I had an affinity for classification of animals and plants. I know every animal. If you show me a picture of an animal, any animal, I could probably tell you what name. But anyways, if I could append your question earlier before you asked me if I was a cop, another kind of wake up for me. And this relates to the cop thing.
Not that that was a serious question, but the whole Occupy Wall Street thing happened around the time that I graduated from high school and just after I had graduated from high school and I went into college that same year. 2012, the fall of 2012. The green, the center of the downtown New Haven. Historically it's always been a place where people are allowed to come to protest, practice free speech.
So after Occupy Wall Street, there was a ton of people that they kind of lived in these homeless camps in certain places that they occupied and the Green was one of them. So there was like a spillover of those types of people that were around during that time period that kind of influenced me to be a little bit more anarchistic and free thinking and like fuck the police type mentality.
Smash the Starbucks. And that's another thing that kind of now I think twice about in the same way that I was like I kind of fell for the war propaganda at a very young age and then I wised up to it. I kind of think of police as like, sure there are corrupt polices, police officers, there's corrupt police forces, there's whole towns that are controlled by corrupt police.
Sure, I've had my run ins with the police. I've been put in a holding cell once I've done things, I'm not the perfect person. I've never hurt anybody, but I definitely had my run ins with cops. I could hate cops from that position, but I don't, because I see that there are good cops and that for the most part, I'd rather live in a country where there's order and that bad guys get arrested for doing things like hurting people or breaking in houses or selling drugs that kill people and leave people basically poisoned mentally and physically.
So, yeah, I do like cops now. Whereas if you ask me what I thought about the police when Bernie Sanders was running for president, I would have been like, f the police and throw on, like, let's. Yeah, I definitely have grown to think about my thoughts in hindsight, and I think that's a good thing when some people they don't like, especially now you're having a podcast, you put your opinions out there and then people change their mind over time.
And maybe that doesn't sit right with people who listen to these podcasts and like, oh, I loved your podcast because I agreed with you and now I don't agree with you. And it's like, well, maybe that means that you need to grow up too, or maybe that means you need to change, too, and hey, we might not have the same change, but that I'm changing, right? And I think that's important for everybody to have that flexibility to be able to change their mind on a topic or an opinion or perspective if better reasoning comes along to show you otherwise.
I don't think there's anything wrong with having an opinion. But yeah, I've definitely had moments where I've looked back and said, like, I was really wrong about that, and I like that. I especially like having those moments on the podcast. I think that shows people that, oh, maybe I don't know everything, so don't go emailing me and saying, like, well, you need to do blah, blah, blah. It's like, hey, I'm not perfect.
I'm not going to get everything right. But also, it's a good point because I think in this community, too, sort of like in the scientific community, there's certain people that have almost made their career on certain perspectives and viewpoints. And I kind of feel like sometimes in the back of my head, even if they change their mind on something, let's say that Flat Earth was your thing, right, and you just made it your thing and you became an authority on it? What happens if you've got a huge following and a patreon and subscribers and they all want to talk about how they agree with you on Flat Earth? If you were to change your mind, are you ready to give all that up or would you just keep playing the act? Yeah, exactly.
Just lean into it and becomes like a thing. Like wrestling. Yeah. And I don't want to speak on anybody specifically because I have friends that believe in flat earth and one of the first podcasts I ever recorded was with my friend Reva who lives on a farm and lives by the Bible. She lives by what it says in the Bible and one of her beliefs that she cannot be shaken on no matter what is that the earth is flat.
And I respect the hell out of her for that because it's made her life better. Maybe not that aspect specifically, but just living by the Bible and everything that comes with that has made her life better. I mean, I envy her lifestyle. Her and her family own a dairy farm and it's a beautiful situation to live in. But yeah, it's an interesting thing to your point. I think the internet has this aspect to it where you can find yourself in a silo.
And I've found one particular YouTuber who hey, everybody has a past. Maybe he's changed. Sure. But there's one guy in particular, he's done some pretty weird shit in the past and it's public information now. Other YouTubers have talked about it, but he's got like this cult following and some people were like, oh, you should have this guy on your podcast. And I had to make the decision like, okay, do I want to have this guy on or do I not? And ultimately the thing that from his past did factor in a little bit because that's the type of person I am where if I know something about you that I don't like, I might not like you.
And that's just my character. I don't know. Wait, but you'll deliver pastries to a genocidal war criminal? Man. This this guy here yale University's economic Department. Although it is weird that they are in the former home of the Bush department. I don't know that there are any Bush people that but that I mean, I might argue that Yale's Economic Department could be even worse than the well, I did say earlier that know not the best person, but yeah, that's a good point.
Maybe I shouldn't throw stones at Glass house. Well, this was an awesome sort of concept that changing your mind in this kind of category. It's weird. Like saying community is such a weird thing because it doesn't always feel like an actual community. It's just like a shared interest. But in this community, changing your mind about certain topics feels a little more rare than it should and sometimes it takes more effort.
But with that in mind, keep in mind that open flexibility and I want to figure out where you're at right now on a whole bunch of different sort of topics. So I'm going to mention something almost Rorschach style and I just want you on a scale from one to ten on how much you believe it. So if you say like a zero or a one then it just means you think it's a psyop it's nonsense.
And if it's ten, you're like, all in, and you would want to convince everybody else to be all in because you're so convinced, so makes sense. Okay. And if there's ones that you want to have to add qualifiers and like, oh, let me explain this more. Just give it like a five, and we'll circle back around to most of these. Okay, so here we go. I'm rating these on a one through five scale.
One through ten? One through ten. Five means, like, you're on the fence. Okay. Was Bob Marley assassinated? Ten. Absolutely. Do you think there's hidden treasure on Oak Island? Depends on your definition of treasure. Buried pirate gold. I'm glad this is a scale, because I would say six for this one. Okay. Was the Black Plague engineered by ancient elites of the time? Seven. Okay. Are chupacabras real? Four. Do you think Jack the Ripper's identity was covered up by the British monarchy? Yes.
Ten. Do you think Big Pharma hides natural cures to maximize profits? Absolutely. The correct answer there would have been 20 or 30. Is the Patterson gimlin bigfoot footage genuine? Well, you were there last time. I talked about it with Nate for Reality Stars when you guys were more convinced when I showed you the stabilized footage. Yeah, you showed me this footage, and although I don't remember how everybody else felt, and I tend to be somewhat of a pushover, although I don't like to admit that, but if other people present me with a pretty good opinion, I can waiver, but that still sticks with me.
That was one of the first times I ever really saw something outside of the norm. Like when I was reading Ripley's Believe It or not in my elementary school library, and I saw the still image of one of the frames from that footage in Ripley's Believe It or not, and I just looked at it. I was like, whoa, that's a real animal. I just always thought that was a real because it was in Ripley's.
Well, the image, it just always struck me as that's an like, as I said earlier, I love animals. If you show me any animal, aside from sea creatures for the most part, and insects, I can identify pretty much any animal. So are we talking six? Are we talking ten here? I'm talking specifically the Patterson gimlin footage. Not bigfoot as a whole, but the Patterson gimlin footage in particular.
All right, so then I did learn some things that call it into question, so I'm going to go with seven, which is much lower. Okay, that still sounds like it's pretty credible. Okay. Did werewolves exist within the last 500 years? And by werewolf, I mean, like, a truly shape shifting now you're a wolf, now you're a person, now you're a wolf kind of deal. Yeah. 1010. Do governments already possess free energy technology and they're just suppressing it from us? Yeah, of course.
What else. Are those UFOs? Ten. Can you harvest energy from crystals alone and not like lasers, but can you just go out and farm crystals? Is that a 1010? And then finally, did Alastair Crowley really talk to an alien and or, um, I'm going to say he definitely talked to a demon. So if we're going to say demon, then, yeah, eight demon. Eight. So I want to start on that one and work backwards a little bit because I'm truly fascinated at the concept of angels and demons and good and evil, especially as objective things.
Because just like you were mentioning, everything has to fit a certain logic and make kind of sense. Once you start talking about true evil or true good, it feels like that. And there's this realm of subjectiveness. So I want to just understand first, are you religious when you talk about demon? Are you talking about a Christian version of a demon or do you interpret demons as some other kind of entity? That's the thing.
I don't think about it in terms of Christian or the other. Maybe this could be simply answered with just a yes. But I would say that regardless of your cultural context, they exist. If Christians have studied it and have information about it, I treat that as equal to what a shaman in a tribe would say, let's say in Siberia or South America or Africa or Australia or North America, like even Europe.
There are groups everywhere, literally all seven continents, who have lore, rituals, experiences with entities that they describe in a number of mean. I recently talked to Paul Staubbs, who's convinced that they're all connecting with the nephilim. When they say ancestor, I mean, regardless of what they mean by ancestors, there's clearly something that people let into their psyche and they let that possess them. And we have other versions of that where people are possessed against their will and maybe things start to manifest in their life that lead to illness or misfortune.
People have had those experiences throughout time. I don't think there's any discounting that it's just people don't like to believe it because it's uncomfortable. And I think, unfortunately, the way you live your life, whether it's behavior that's learned or genetic, I think some people, they just have a propensity to attract negativity and they live maybe a life that's harder than someone who has the opposite effect, where they attract positivity.
I think there's ways of even reversing it where maybe you're a very negative person and something changes and now you have a more positive turn in life and your karma or your destiny or however you want to term it changes. But I think these beings, whatever they are, demons, I don't think it's necessarily a religious context because every religion talks about some form of or another of this.
So I think when it comes down to it, there are ways to live your life correctly, healthily, and avoid those types of beings. And I think those types of beings take advantage of us when we are not living our life in a correct or healthy way. A correct being definitely on a spectrum, there's not one way to live your life. But as far as the seven deadly sins or what you should and shouldn't do is pretty established across the world, right? So I think demons, they gravitate to people who commit murder and things like well, maybe there's one example that's somewhat famous from not Jordan Maxwell, though.
I love Jordan Maxwell from Joseph Campbell. And he mentions I think this was a Marco Polo book, but he goes to or it might have been a different historian. He goes to a foreign land and he sees at a funeral the family of the deceased is eating their body and he thinks these people are devils, they're demons. This is like the most disgusting thing that how could you possibly not venerate your dead? Why aren't you treating it with more respect? And they were like, well, this is how we respect the dead.
What do you guys do? What do you mean? You just bury it in the ground and let it waste away? What about all of the knowledge and the wisdom that needs to be transferred to the rest of the family and passed down so clearly, culturally, something as horrific as maybe cannibalism could be seen as a good thing aside from Kuru and getting like a protein in your brain that eats it away and turns it into mush.
But I don't think the morality version of that was evil. But the point being made from that story was that when he went back and told all of his Christian sort of family and friends and everybody else that they thought that was just absolute Satan, right? Like nothing but Satan would be causing someone to do that and it was just this know, disconnect. So, I mean, I'm curious in that regard.
But I also want to ask you, since you're familiar with Alistair Crowley, you've talked about him a few times and read a lot of his stuff. Do you think that someone that was secular atheist agnostic could go and pick up Crowley's work, read through it and successfully summon a demon? Or do you think you'd actually have to do horrible things and become a negative person and actually become evil in order to attract the evil? Or do you think, know, magical incantations and rituals and sigils and stuff could bring you there alone? Well, I think people have a Hollywood version of what they think of as, like, demon and evil.
Well, it shoots laser eyes out of its eyes. That's basically no, but I think, yeah, evil can manifest in ways that you don't recognize. Like, you can become a version of yourself that you never wanted to be. That's a version of evil where you neglect yourself or you neglect others. You abuse yourself or you abuse others. I think that's a form of evil. And maybe people who take a sort of negative vibration in life and stick with that cord end up attracting something that agrees with that negative vibration and then manifests more of it in that person's life in like a parasitic know I think in that sense, Alistair Crowley's books could yes, perfectly.
Like if you follow the recipe perfectly, maybe, you know, do something that know, an atheist would then kind of have like a revelation from and be like, oh, there must be something more. Now that's possible. But I don't think that someone like that would have the same result as somebody who was naive or innocent or had a magical mindset. I think those people actually shouldn't interact with this kind of stuff because those are kind of like the people who are to use my name in vain.
They're like the marks for the spiritual scam that is like these parasites. I've experienced it myself by taking Alistair Crowley's book out in public. Like I attracted the vibration that was associated with that book and homeless schizophrenic type person, I don't know, I'm not judging them, I don't have any ill feelings about them, but that's the best way I could describe them. They looked homeless. They kind of looked disheveled.
They walked into the cafe that I was working in where I happened to have this book and it was too busy of a cafe for me to read, but I've always been obsessed with books, so I just keep a book with me in case I have a moment to read. And that day I happened to bring that book along and this guy walks into the cafe and he opens up a Bible, sits down at the table and puts these little candles on the type that are electronic with the little battery.
He turns these little candles on and he's doing his own little seance right there in the cafe. He wanted to do a wizard war. That was him challenging you? It might have been because I accepted his challenge. I walked over to his table and I said, sir, you need a coffee to be in this realm conducting magic. I didn't say that, but said, you need a coffee to be in this cafe or you need to buy something.
And he's like, I'm going to buy something in a minute. He was offended. But hey, don't get mad at me. You look like a homeless person. We have this problem all the time. You can't just come in here and beat the heat. It's just not the way life works. Sorry, I didn't make it this way. So that was my job, unfortunately, was kicking out homeless people. So he bought a coffee and as he angrily bought a coffee from me, he says to me, you know, I'm the 7th Incarnate or I'm the grandson of Alastair Crowley and the 7th incarnation of, you know, some crazy, aggressive boast that included the name Alastair Crowley and Manson.
And the weird thing is, the book wasn't like, on the shelf. It wasn't on the coffee bar in front of me, it was underneath on a shelf, so it wasn't like, in view. This guy didn't see me reading it when he walked in. He just walked in. The book was under there. And so it was very weird that his angry statement that he made was, I'm the incarnation of Charles Manson and the great grandson of Aleister Crowley, or whatever.
I forget exactly the pronoun he used, but yeah, it was very OD and that kind of stuck with me to this day. Like, these books that Alistair Crowley wrote have like a weird energy, especially the book I had in particular. It's called Book Four. It's all about magic and he talks about sacrificing a child being the most energetic ritual or whatever. And all these Crowley apologists say, oh, no, he's actually talking about masturbation.
He's not actually talking about killing a child, he's talking about that's interesting, I hadn't heard that before. Saying it's like spilling your seed was him saying sacrificing a child. And it is weird because he's a particularly perverted writer. These poetry books, one of them called Snowdrops, which itself sounds like a double entendre for come, but he writes about these really weird pedophilic relationships in that book, like a sailor and a deck boy or whatever they called it back in the day.
Some young girl and an older guy. So he has this perverted poetry. And when I read that book, I didn't buy it, but I knew what it was and I saw it on the bookshelf, so I looked through it. Somebody bought it a few weeks after I looked through it because it was gone, but I looked I probably would have grabbed it if it was a signed copy.
I looked at the poetry and it was so perverted. I was like, wow, I really regret ever interacting with this guy's material after reading this. And it was all around the time when pizzagate had reached like a fever pitch and people were doing like, Save the Children marches and stuff. And it all culminated to Sam and I having that podcast on Tinfoil Hat where he yells at me because he thought I was defending Alastair Crowley after I told him all these evil things I suppose Alistair Crowley could have done because it was allegedly that's one weird thing about him.
I think it goes to show that he was kind of a guy who was protected to some degree because he was involved in espionage and Mi Six, although not on the record, he did allegedly do things that appear to be ordained by the Crown, so to speak. So maybe they had a hand in covering up his crimes. But for the most part, there's no evidence other than his own writings and what other people write about him and what authors have written about him to suggest that he did anything criminal.
He was abusive, sure, but there's no evidence that he did anything criminal. He did get kicked out of Italy and there was rumors that he was doing some satanic rituals with some woman and her children, which, hey, that could be it right there. And I made that point on that podcast. But that is like a shadow looming over me, that interview, because since then, I just haven't really talked much about Crowley.
I did one episode with Cheney because she asked me to specifically talk about Alistair Crowley. And she's awesome. I really appreciate her. She had me on her show back when I didn't even have a podcast yet. So she's awesome. If she asked me to research him again, I'd do it for but I'm not interested in him as much as I used to be because I do feel like his energy, whatever it represents, can lead people into a dark place.
And that might be something that people bring to themselves and manifest themselves, and you could blame them for that, maybe other factors in their life that are to blame for it. But for me, it did feel like the closer I got into that material, the more weird sort of dark tinged things would happen. Why do you think that in particular has so much, I guess, influence still today? People wear shirts and they do the hand signs and they drop the name and maybe this is a subjective statement, but why do you think that Crowley is more popular than, say, like, Blavatsky or any other number of occultists from that time? What is it about Crowley in particular that still resonates? It's just his publicity stunts.
Like he was somebody who believed in no such thing as bad press. That whole motto. He reveled in being seen as the biggest baddest man in the world and Wickedest, evil, whatever he wanted to call himself. Maybe that played into his cover. And a lot of what it seems like he was doing, if you read Richard Spence's work, is it seems like he was going into secret societies that were prevalent at the time and sort of busting them up from the inside just by being an asshole and just having like a really brash and kind of self centered, narcissistic personality.
He had his positive aspects, but he had a lot of flaws that I think outweigh those positive aspects. And he maybe used that to an edge, like it was his sort of weapon against these secret societies. Because if you look at his track record, like, he goes into, what was it? The Golden Dawn first or the Order of Thalema. I think that was what he started. The Order of Thalima eventually became that, but there were two groups that he joined and after leaving those groups, he was either the leader or had a fight with the and like, I think both of them ended up kind of failing and kind of becoming something else.
So I wonder to myself, it seems like Spence implies this too, with his research. It's like maybe there was a secret agenda to break up these groups because they saw the political power that these groups might pose in rival to what the Crown in England had going on because they were very much trying to get their control over America and all the other territories. Still to this day, I think, you know, if not in control of America has some sort of control over American politics.
And I think they use agents like Crowley back then at least, to bust up a lot of these secret societies. So to answer your question more accurately, pop culture made Crowley who he is after his mean before he died. I don't think he was even really that well known outside of the weird community of people who are interested in this, kind of know. He had letters in correspondence with Parsons and other people like that, but as far as I know, he was like a drug addicted old man and died kind of miserably.
But because of that publicity stunt streak that he had, I think the rock and roll hippie movement kind of latched on to that because it was counterculture. His ideas represented a lot of what they felt in the counterculture. And you see him in the Beatles album, you see him in Ozzy Osborne's song, you see Led Zeppelin's guitarist Jimmy Page obsessed with him to the point of buying his former residence and kind of spiraling into the really weird place in his life.
I mean, you look at what his band members said about him at that period in his life and it seemed like they even didn't really understand what was going on with him. So, yeah, there is the power that pulls people in with Crowley and I mean, maybe that's because he was particularly interested in being this child of the new Aeon. And in order to do that, he had to interact with these devilish negative spirits and make those bargains where, yeah, we'll make you famous, we'll make you powerful, but there's going to be a risk to this reward we're giving you or there's going to be a consequence to this benefit you're getting.
And that's like the classic thing the jazz players said around that time, too. Like, oh, you go down on the crossroads and you make a deal with the devil. That old Southern tale, right? That's something that people even talk about to this day, people going down. Well, even now when someone gets popular and they get like a Billboard top hit, the Automatic is like, oh, I wonder what family member they had to sacrifice in order to get that number one hit.
I feel like it still happens today. I think that's more to the point of your earlier question about why is crowley more well known over like Blavatsky and these other people. It's because I think culture just moves on and there's these trends that go on and people forget like, I wonder in 50 years if people are going to look back and be like, oh, remember when people did social media and had phones in their pockets? I mean, how crazy was that? Meanwhile, we're here in 2020 something, and in the 18 hundreds, people were doing seances.
That was a popular thing to do on a Friday night. Go to a seance and maybe talk to some spirits, get some insight from a dead famous person. Like we're going to channel the mind of freaking what's his name over in Russia. The guy who had Putin. Yeah, Rasputin or like St. Germain or whatever they were advertising and a lot of that stuff that in the they looked at it as silly and fake and snake oil salesmen.
And that's a big reason how the holistic medicine got phased out. To answer your other point that was on the list about pharmaceutical companies suppressing holistic or natural cures. They lumped all that stuff together as like folklore and Hocom and pseudo witchcraft type BS. And that's a big reason why we're in this chemically induced society now where everything's prescription or chemical or warning label and I don't think they would have saw that coming back then.
But to get back to my question about Crowley and my larger points, like secret societies were in vogue at a certain point in this country. So things like getting some sort of upper edge or getting ahead in life, so to speak, you could maybe accomplish that by communicating with some lost relative from beyond who gives you some kernel of wisdom you can use or make a deal with some entity and local elemental spirit or something like that.
I think that was a lot more commonplace and maybe musicians kind of carried that information along as music became more part of the culture and less of a thing that was like commonplace. Music used to be something in the community. There'd be like a guy playing guitar at a bar and everybody went to that bar, they just played the same fucking ten songs or made up a few songs, but people didn't know music for weren't going on tour with huge productions.
It wasn't like a thing where people were like, oh yeah, have you heard of this guy? It was just like, oh, this guy plays guitar. That's nice. That's really interesting because you mentioned earlier when you're talking about Crowley that he really reveled in that narcissism and self promotion and bad press is good press, right? Like all press is good press for him. And I kind of see that resonate with, I guess, Hollywood and rock and rollers like the Beatles famously bigger than Jesus, right? That was a sacrilege thing to say, but it was right on the exact same lines of alastair Crowley calling himself the wickedest man in the world and the great beast because it was this outlandish like how dare know say that they've got this much power and now that's pretty much what being a celebrity is.
It's having the balls to be like I'm the best at this. Um, and I feel like maybe that's that energy, maybe that's the crowlean energy is just being balls out. That's a good literally comparison you make too. I mean, bringing Hollywood into this as I was just thinking like theater kind of played a big role in bringing the occult from that time period into the modern time. Mean people think about trends now and they're instant, right? Everybody knows around the world or around the English speaking world what's trending if they are in touch with it, right? But back then when you had the 1832 antimasonic movement, a lot of the secret societies on the East Coast either disbanded, became public or went underground.
And I started to wonder, and I haven't really ventured into this research much, I start to wonder maybe that instead of just like giving up, they move west. And it seems like secret societies maintain popularity as the frontier went west as this trend may die big time. Not only that, I think that I've been pulling at this thread too, because on the East Coast you had people still go into court up until the 17 hundreds.
I think in the early 18 hundreds was the last trial where a man was put on trial for being a wizard. He was acquitted. But it shows that there was still a legal process in place for prosecuting people that were allegedly dabbling in magic or black arts. Meanwhile, on the West Coast you had Rosicrucianism, which was pretty much as occult as it kind of got at that point.
But they didn't have that same sort know, derogatory relationship to know devil worshippers or evil or burn them at the stake. And I think there was a huge difference between the West Coast and the East Coast and the West Coast kind of flourished and we still see that today and a completely different vibe and mentality because of that. Right, well, and people forget too, like how closely connected the East Coast was to Europe, whereas the Midwest and the west became really the America that we know today and contributed more so in some ways to what America is now.
But yeah, the further you went west back then, the wilder and more outlaw it was. And I think a lot of those secret groups that dabbled or frequently utilized occult ritual activity to their benefit went west. I mean, you see the Rosicrucians and Bohemian Grove and all these other things that are out there that even to this day are still maintaining some membership. I don't know what their activities are, but I wonder because to bring this back, to know how much of the Crowley popularity was also due in part to his interest in the West Coast because he traveled to California.
He was in California around that time that Hollywood was kind of beginning when a lot of the theater acts became like movie studios. Like, that kind of that was also before actors were necessarily celebrities too. Just kind of like what you were mentioning with the musicians. There weren't necessarily these huge blockbuster celebrities up until around that time. And I think that's that and that's kind of where I was angling.
This whole point to is and I'm glad you said that, you took the words right out of my mouth this sort of cult activity centered around idol worship in many ways. And maybe in the past it was like Dionysus or Artemis or whatever. There's dozens of entities you can pick from from either Greek, Roman or whatever pantheon. But I think they realized the power of that and said, let's make money by creating this with a person.
You see that with Elvis. You see that with the Beatles. You see that with Marilyn Manson. Or not Marilyn Manson. Marilyn Monroe. Well, you kind of kind of with both. I mean, he's also a celebrity, right? But that's decades later. I'm talking about the first generation of stars, right? And I wonder how much of that was particularly geared in these small communities at first. Like, you had maybe like local stars that were like theater acts or small time musicians.
That it's funny that we even still call it stars. Like you yourself are saying stars. And that's exactly what Alistair Crowley used to refer to people that were kind of know, doing as they will, is that they were stars. See, I think that's where we get a lot of our terms from that time period. I'm sort of in a spot with all of that where it seems like there's something darker there.
I just haven't quite figured it out. I mean, the obvious may be like, oh, they're channeling demons or these aliens or whatever, but it definitely feels like there's something to this occult activity. Maybe it's an aggregore or a hive mind or just something to it that I think they've geared towards the rest of us on a mass scale. I think Michael Hoffman talks about it in Secret Societies and Psychological Warfare.
I'm just not thinking of the right term right now. But it's like a hypnosis that they've put on a lot of people. And that's part of what the awakening is that we talked about the beginning with the whole podcast suppression topic. People are waking up because they're like, oh, yeah, the news TV that's all corporate sponsored. Like, I want something real. I want something authentic. And that's why you see Joe Rogan as one of the most popular entertainment content type of thing out there because he's just himself in many ways.
You might not like everything he's interested in, but for the most part he's just doing Joe and that's why it is titled the way it is. I think people really are into that. Maybe that's part of that same mentality of like now everybody can be a star and that's why they love a show like that. Because they're like oh, I feel like I'm friends with this really famous guy because I listen to him 8 hours a week and I know everything he knows.
And now I like eating elk and I like bow and arrow. It has that kind of like even with our podcast we have people who hit us up. They're like dude, I love that one episode. You know, if we were to hang out, we would smoke weed. And it's like I so love when people say all that, but it's like hey man, I don't know you from Adam.
Yeah, sure, we have a lot in common. But podcasting has that effect where you kind of really get close to people. And I know I'm going all over the place here, but I think that's kind of something they're using against us. And there's benefits. There's definitely upsides to what we're going through. I think the awakening is like a self correction because nature has these self corrections inherent to it.
Like these self correcting gears. Like when something gets out of balance, this other equal and opposite force comes in and balances it. I really believe in that very karmic, I got to ask you again, we're not going back into the fullest of questions, but zero to ten Joe Rogan sold some part of his soul to a demon in order to get to where he is. Well, I have to say zero on that one just because I'm connected to Sam and you're not allowed to even say one.
I respect Sam so much that I just wouldn't want to talk about his friend, like personally. You know, I've had my ups and downs with Rogan. Like I wouldn't know who Sam was if it wasn't for Joe Rogan's show. Because once I found out who Joe Rogan was, I started listening to all these other comedy podcasts and that's how I eventually found Tinfoil Hat. Was that when you first started eating elk too? He wasn't into that yet.
It's funny, I liked a lot of Joe Rogan's opinions back then and I did listen kind of like just as background noise while I was gaming. I mean this was like when I was in my early twenty s. I would just smoke weed and game and I'm like this is boring. I got to listen to something while I'm gaming because what am I doing here? I'm just wasting time.
So I started listening to that. But no, I think know it's interesting. Sam made a really good point while we were at his show the other night in the green room, he was talking, eddie Bravo was there. So naturally Joe Rogan came up. I forget how, but. Sam made a really good point. Joe's really good at disclosing information that he doesn't necessarily believe. So he'll put something out there on his podcast and say, like, oh, but that's crazy.
That's ridiculous. But his show's so big that it's kind of like a soft disclosure. Like, if he came out like Alex Jones and was like, the aliens, the reptilians they're going to kill, like, people would be like, no, that's stupid. He's obviously that Alex Jones impression is way better than I was expecting it to be, by the way. Way better. I'm not bad at impressions. I did that black voice earlier or that Southern voice earlier, but whatever.
Can we do a black Alex Jones? No, I'm just kidding. AI is going to have to come up with we could probably do that. We could just blend it in. We'll take like, little boozy and Alex Jones and just train it on the both of them. But I think Joe has that ability where he could bring up something know, maybe you don't necessarily have that same result that you get with Jones where people are a little more skeptical or off put by his delivery.
With Joe, he can be like, no, that's crazy. But tell me more. The straight man. It's the same. Like, if you're doing a comedy, right, you have to have the straight man that reacts to all the comedic stuff. Otherwise, nothing really makes any sense. That's the person that needs that structure, right? That's the mark. Well, that's me. That's how I felt on Illuminati, confirmed sometimes when Chris and Juan would tee off on me.
Really? So you felt like the straight man sometimes on a what's an outlandish theory that a lot of people bring up and you can't say flat earth because you already said it, that a lot of people bring up and you're just, ah, not this freaking topic again. Well, I do love Tartaria for many reasons because it kind of got me a bug in me to look into my own local area.
But I do get a little bit triggered when I hear people make some statements within that realm. And I don't want to get too specific because, again, there are some aspects to the whole theory concept that I think are interesting and worthwhile. But there is a lot of people who now have these Instagram accounts where all they do is show you a picture of a building and say, there's no way we could have built this in 1850.
There's no way we could have built this in 17 whatever before there were like, human rights violations or any sort of workman's comp. Yeah. And I look around, I'm like, dude, I live in a town that's 400 years old. It's almost 400 years old. It's literally on the shore. Is one of the first or was it already there when the explorers showed up and they just moved in and said they made it that's the thing that could be true.
Sure. And that's a big thing that people say, and I don't particularly know either way, but I think it's just too convenient. I can go into my Milford library here in the town of Milford that was founded in 1636, and I could find literally a list of every single person that's lived or owned property in this town since it was founded. Right. I think that means something. It might not mean that everything we're told is exactly how it is, but I don't necessarily think that the people who said they built this were lying to cover up the fact that they maraudered it.
That could be the case with certain structures like down in, what is it called? Fort Jefferson in the dry Tortugas. That's an interesting wonder. You know, maybe that was built much earlier and the United States just kind of claimed it. But when it comes know, buildings like around here where I live, it seems pretty obvious like that they were there when they said they built them and not previous to that.
But why I get a little bit triggered, I guess is more because when I started looking into it I found out that there are actually evidence. There is evidence of other cultures, let's say beyond the British, the French, the Dutch, the Spanish and the Native Americans that had an impact here on the East Coast before Columbus. And even the Native Americans whose history has been so just massacred, chopped to pieces and thrown by the wayside.
I mean, literally there's been a genocide on these people. They've been removed from their land and put in poverty. And sure some of them are doing all right now, but I'm sure they would like to have their land that they have. How do you think they felt on 911? What do you think the general consent? Do you think there was a big wave of patriotism within the reservation communities? I can't speak for Native Americans, I just wouldn't want to.
Not that I'm some kind of like bleeding heart liberal, but I do think that they're particularly skeptical of anything the government does and with good reason. So I wouldn't be surprised if they immediately recognize the false flag. And unfortunately, I've heard from natives themselves that there are a lot of Native Americans that kind of are blue pilled, so to speak, or know they've been born into this situation where it's better to get along than go against it.
Right. It did seem like Bernie Sanders had a certain demographic locked compared to at least the opponents when it came to that for I mean, I'm sure Native Americans there's plenty of support for know, I don't know much. There might be a bunch of Native American Trump supporters out there who would agree. I would suspect that more than anything. But I don't know. Yeah, because I've seen tons of Native Americans who just have Trump flags there are certain Native American communities near me, and you could tell sometimes I'm a Native bumper sticker and they'll have, like, a Trump bumper sticker next to so I've seen that for sure.
But then again, interesting dynamic to me, man. I think it's uniquely American. Not in a good or a bad way, but just I'm sure Australia has aboriginals and stuff, but I feel like within America, us being so damn new. And also, like you were mentioning before, right after 911, people got this patriotism thing, but then you also mentioned there was this aspect of, like, I don't trust those brown people, you know what I mean? But in America, it's so interesting because you could be like, I don't trust that guy over there, and the guy over there could be American.
You know, like, respond in, like, a New York accent, and you'd be, you know, you get the pass, and then you move on to the next one. And it's interesting because up until this last century, being a nationalist almost meant that you could visually decide if someone was part of your nation or not. And now specifically in America, that all completely goes away. And now there's all these other cues.
They're like cultural cues that determine whether or not you're part of this nation. I don't know. I find that beyond fascinating. Yeah, when I was a kid, I remember seeing shirts and bumper stickers that said stuff like, oh, you're worried about the illegal immigrants while we were here. First they would have, like, pictures, native Americans holding rifles and stuff. And I always liked that kind of stuff because I'm like, yeah, they're right.
What the hell? I don't know. I've always kind of been anticolonialistic in that sense. But, hey, then again, my whole life is predicated on colonialism. I think every American's life is predicated on colonialism in some way because a lot of our resources, whether we realize it or not, come from Third World countries where aspects of colonialism are still alive today. Right? I mean, people who are being basically taken advantage of for their resource wealth, and it's just a sad situation around the world.
So I have a lot of empathy for the Native Americans and the indigenous people around the world. And I kind of forget what question led us here, but I know I don't have that much more time. I asked you to justify why you were delivering pastries to war criminals, and you just kind of kept detracting and going on tangents, and that's how we ended up rewind the tape.
But I want to mean we could go on for another couple hours. I wanted to get into Bob Marley in particular because that's a fascinating one, but we're going to save that one for next time. And I also don't mean to drop, like, a huge bomb right at the end of this. This one could blow it wide open. We could go for another hour. But I have to know, do you believe in dinosaurs? Well, it's interesting because the same yeah, I don't I believe less and less in dinosaurs.
The more I learn about these guys that studied dinosaurs in the 18 hundreds, it seems like they are all in cahoots with the same people that own the oil company. And I wonder own the oil companies. I wonder if they were in some kind of plan to give people this different notion of the earth and convert people to this more atheistic mindset, to make people more subservient and less.
Because if somebody believes in God, then they can have no master other than God, right? So I think they started to create these narratives that went against the Bible. And I used to not believe in this stuff for a long time. When I was raised Catholic, I totally was like, no, this is all crap. Like, I'm an atheist. I don't believe in that. I like science. I've really gone.
Do you believe in dinosaurs at that time too? Yeah, obviously. I didn't really even think it was a question. But now I think about it, I'm like, well, these bones that they pull out of the ground, maybe they're found in ways that look like certain creatures. And the way we are told, oh, this was a delililapodidosaurus, or this is a branchosaurus. Or maybe that's just all sort of a reconstruction of the truth.
And it's closer to the truth that there were dragons and there were other types of maybe what we would consider more mythical beings, as the Bible describes, right, where there was all this genetic manipulation going on and people were creating like chimeras and half man, half horse and all this other weird stuff. I mean, who knows? Maybe that's what it is. And it's like they don't want us to know about the time before the flood when there are all these weird creatures.
Because when you look at like I don't know how accurate this is, but there's a stone carving in Thailand or Indonesia. I'm not sure exactly where this giant Angkor Wat is. It might be in Thailand, but there's a relief in Angkor watt of a man on what looks like a stegosaurus and he's riding the back of a stegosaurus of all animals. I mean, a stegosaurus has like, plates, spiny plates on its back.
So I don't know how that works. He was like a prehistoric Gigi Allen or something. Maybe he was like a prehistoric, I don't know, Napoleon on his horse and stegosaurus instead. I don't mean the Carthaginians rode elephants, right? The war elephants. But elephants don't have spiny plates protruding from their back, so it poses a different set of problems. But it's like the club. It's like the antitheft device.
Like you can't steal someone's stegosaurus because you don't know the perfect place to sit. Well, in South America too, there's stories of people flying with pterodactyls, like using pterodactyls as early form of travel. Same way you would pull a horse, would pull a cart. These pterodactyls would pull people on these rigs that they would strap to them. So I don't know how true that is. That could just be some sort of dream somebody wrote up in the 18 hundreds and purported it as a real story.
But I think there's a lot of evidence to suggest that what we think of dinosaurs now is not true. And I just call into question the scientific timeline. I think the biblical timeline has more interesting aspects to it, and curiously, they seem to line up with some things that we find around the world. But then again, I don't know. I have talked to a lot of Christians in the past few months, so I could have just kind of been biased a little bit by their perspectives.
I haven't looked that far into it. But there is this thing that anybody who's interested in the dinosaurs, whether they're real or not, should look up. And it's called the Bone Wars. And it comprised of two gentlemen who were friends that basically fought each other to compete to see who can discover more dinosaurs. And it seems like they just took one type of creature and gave it, like, 700 different names and moved a bone over here and said, oh, well, this is a Tyrannosaurus rex.
0. This is a Tyrannosaurus rex. 2. I think they were just doing that kind of science, foolery. They were like, mashing the AI generate button, right? And like, oh, I'm going to call this one of this. Yeah, well, it seems like, yeah, they were just, like, playing with Legos when they came with these dinosaur bones. Who knows? Maybe better analogy. Yeah, maybe the dinosaur bones were actually giant skeletons that were supposed to be in man form.
You take, like, six of them and rearrange them, and you can make, like, a Tyrannosaurus rex. I mean, who knows? They could have been like, hey, we have all these stupid giant bones that we don't want anybody to know the truth about. Let's just rearrange them and put them on display. We can carve them. We can shape them. I mean, half of the dinosaurs you see in the museum, they say it's just plaster cast.
It's not actually the real. So this is like the Smithsonian is basically like Taco Bell. They've got five ingredients, and they just rearrange them in, like, 80 different ways. Like Taco Bell. That's the best metaphor we could have for this. It's like five ingredients and they just rearrange it. A chalupa, a burrito, a taco. It's all the same thing and just a different presentation. I think that's a good place to end this.
And we covered good ground today. I mean, we did dinosaurs and Crowley and flat earth and mud flood and all kinds of stuff. Man, I would go longer if I didn't have, unfortunately, another podcast scheduled. But yeah, this is really fun, dude. Anytime we'll have a part two, we'll have a part two because these first ones are mainly interviews. And then when we talk again, we can go deep on some specific topics and stuff and there's not going to be any sort of end to where we could end up going.
So I'm looking forward to it, man. So tell people one more time where to find you, where your podcast is at, and what you got going on. So Myfamilythinksomcrazy. com is the best place to start. If you want to just search the name of the show. Wherever you already listen to podcasts, that's a great way to do it. You could support us on Patreon Rock. Finn substack. That's where you get the show early and you get bonus content, but you can find the show really anywhere.
You listen to podcasts and if you don't find it on the podcast, you listen to it. Listen to shows on. Just email me mfticpodcast@gmail. com and if you have your own podcast, check me out altmediaunited. com and email me. Like I said earlier, altmediaunited@gmail. com and we can get you on the website. So long as you have a podcast and you're willing to post your stuff on our website, there's no cost to you and it's a great way to network and maybe even grow your show.
Learn from others who are doing it better than you could be. So yeah, I think that's a great place to start. And Paranoid American is on Alt Media United. We still got to get your video feed or RSS feed on there, but either way, brother, this has been fun. Let's do it again. If people have a hankering to hear more conversations with the two of us, they're in luck because you've been on My show like three or four times now.
So just go and start there. If you haven't listened to my show before, go and check out Paranoid American. Just search that in the search bar and you'll find at least four or five episodes where Thomas joins me as a guest. Word up, man. Thank you again for coming. And we're going to have many more of these to come. And an extra special shout out to Sam Tripoli.
Thank you for employing and creating jobs in this conspiracy theory world. That's actually one of the coolest things possible. Who knew that doing all this research into conspiracies and alternative history would actually amount to anything? That's the biggest thing people should take? Well, who knew that you could become a professional video game player when we were younger too, right? Like, the parents would be like, you need to go get a job.
And little did they know, if you just would have stuck with that, you could become a millionaire twitch streamer. So parents don't know what the hell they're talking about. So anyways, yeah, don't do what your parents tell you. And tonight I want everyone listening to go out and steal one thing from Target and send it to Mark because he's the real brains behind this operation. Yeah. Give me Marvel, Legends, Omega Kid or Fang, because I don't have them yet.
I'm trying to build. All right, y'all, I'm going to give you, like, a five second lead. Start if you need to just tap the volume down the slightest. I swear that this commercial isn't too loud, but it is a little loud, so here you go. Thanks again. They said it was forbidden. They said it was dangerous. They were right. Introducing the paranoid American Homunculus owner's manual. Dive into the arcane, into the hidden corners of the occult.
This isn't just a comic. It's a hidden tome of supernatural power. All original artwork illustrating the groundbreaking research of Juan Ayala, one of the only living homunculogists of our time. Learn how to summon your own homunculus. An enigma wrapped in the fabric of reality itself. Their power at your fingertips. Their existence, your secret. Explore the mysteries of the Aristotelian, the spiritual, the paracelcian, the crowlean homunculus. Ancient knowledge lost to time, now unearthed in this forbidden tale.
This comic book holds truths not meant for the light of day. Knowledge that was buried, feared and shunned. Are you ready to uncover the hidden? The paranoid American homunculus owner's manual. Not for the faint of heart. Available now from paranoid American. Get your copy@tjojp. com or paranoidamerican. com today. .
Unveiling Mysteries with Paranoid American: A Dive into Alternative Narratives Author: Tommy Truthful Date: September 29
Delving into the mysteries that shroud our world, the Paranoid American podcast, established in 2012, is a channel of enlightenment for those who question mainstream narratives. Dedicating itself to unraveling the obscure aspects of society such as MKUltra mind control, secret societies, forbidden technology, and occult symbols, the podcast explores the unknown with a fervor. The recent episode ushered in Mystic Mark from the “My Family Thinks I’m Crazy” podcast and operator of Alt Media United, a haven for alternative media podcasters. Their conversation sails through the inception and evolution of Paranoid American and traverses through the dark territories of secret societies like Skull and Bones.
The genesis of Paranoid American’s quest was rather humble. Starting as a delivery driver, our enigmatic host stumbled upon peculiarities in his city while tuning into podcasts during work hours. This itch for understanding led him down the rabbit hole of conspiracy theories. His path soon converged with Sam Tripoli, who propelled him further into the realms of the unknown. Growing weary of his delivery gig at Amazon, Paranoid American plunged into the podcasting world, crafting his own show “My Family Thinks I’m Crazy.” His journey now pivots on elevating the niche of alternative research and conspiracy theory—a sector often left in the shadows in podcasting circles.
Venturing into the past, Paranoid Americans cast doubts on the commonly peddled history of Native Americans, prodding at the roles and impacts of different cultures before Columbus set sail. His skepticism didn’t spare the existence of dinosaurs either, hypothesizing that academia might have tailored the truth to fit certain agendas. He toys with the idea of a potential link between extinct creatures and mythical beings chronicled in religious texts.
As the dialogue unfurls, various theories including dinosaurs, flat earth, and mud floods are laid on the table. The conversation rounds off by spotlighting paranoidamerican.com’s homunculus owner’s manual and extending gratitude towards Sam Tripoli for fostering opportunities in the conspiracy theory community.
Paranoid American further elucidates on Alt Media United—a cooperative for independent podcasters to connect, collaborate, and raise the conspiracy alternative podcast genre from the ashes. He stresses the potency of unity among podcasters amid competition, advocating for authenticity, audience engagement, and steering clear from disparaging other podcasts.
The discourse shifts to the equity of podcast rankings, the manipulation of download numbers via bots, and a nifty trick for cheapening purchases by masking product barcodes. It also touches upon the gloomy side of self-checkouts like potential job losses and increased automation which might sideline some consumers based on perceived risk. A silver lining, however, is the personal freedom that podcasting proffers.
Reflecting on his personal evolution, Paranoid American delineates his understanding of his local area and its tie to his personal identity. The scars from the emotional turmoil post the 9/11 attacks and the journey of challenging dominant narratives leading him towards conspiracy theories are also shared. He reminisces about his early zeal to join the military and his subsequent enlightenment regarding wartime propaganda.
The conversation shifts as Mystic Mark unveils his admiration for the police profession, despite discerning corruption within the system. His perspective morphed from anti-police sentiments, courtesy of events like Occupy Wall Street, to valuing law and order. He asserts that perspectives and viewpoints are never set in stone and emphasizes the virtue of remaining malleable to superior reasoning, even if it leads to discord among followers.
The discussion takes a mysterious turn as individuals rate their beliefs on various conspiracy theories, myths, or unknown phenomena. They also meander through the convoluted understanding of good and evil, and the enigma of demons, proposing that cultural context and personal behavior significantly mold one’s encounters with positive or negative energies.
Aleister Crowley’s enigmatic persona and works also find a mention, as Paranoid American narrates his personal encounters with the strange energy surrounding Crowley’s legacy. They argue that Crowley’s autobiography and poetry, laden with questionable content, might ensnare certain individuals into a dark and hazardous domain. Despite scarce concrete evidence about Crowley’s purported crimes, his writings continue to echo through time owing to his controversial publicity stunts, self-proclaimed wickedness, and tumultuous impact on various secret societies.
Through a historical lens, they discuss the evolution of secret societies, the occult, and cultural trends, painting a picture from 1800s scenes to modern-day music and celebrity obsessions. The conversation also highlights the pharmaceutical industry’s role in overshadowing holistic or natural cures and nurturing a chemically dependent society. They postulate that the essence of publicity and narcissism, seminal to both Crowley’s image and modern celebrity culture, have deep-rooted ties.
Delving into the concept of stardom, Paranoid American suggests its roots trace back to Greek or Roman pantheon-like entities, which morphed into a tool for monetary gain as seen in figures like Elvis, The Beatles, and Marilyn Monroe. They analyze the rise of individuals as personal ‘stars’, spotlighting Joe Rogan’s authenticity and the audience’s craving for genuine content. They also delve into secret societies, psychological warfare, and the idea of awakening amidst corporate manipulation. The dialogue shifts to celebrities possibly selling their souls for fame, shedding light on illusions through comedic impressions, and the significance of a straight man in comedy. Expressing disapproval with recurring mentions of the Tartaria conspiracy theory, Paranoid Americans vouches for the credibility of historical records in their hometown. They close with contemplations on the likelihood of historical structures being claimed rather than built by certain societies.
The recent episode of Paranoid American is not just a journey through the obscure, but a reflection on personal evolutions and the endless quest for truth in a world brimming with veiled narratives. The podcast continues to serve as a beacon for those seeking to challenge the orthodox and venture into the realms of the unknown.
-
Paranoid American is the ingenious mind behind the Gematria Calculator on TruthMafia.com. He is revered as one of the most trusted capos, possessing extensive knowledge in ancient religions, particularly the Phoenicians, as well as a profound understanding of occult magic. His prowess as a graphic designer is unparalleled, showcasing breathtaking creations through the power of AI. A warrior of truth, he has founded paranoidAmerican.com and OccultDecode.com, establishing himself as a true force to be reckoned with.
Patreon View all posts -
Hey guys, Tommy Truthful here, leader of the Truth Mafia, CAPO DEI CAPI. I built one of the biggest alternative media conglomerates in the world, brought together some of the biggest names in the game in the truth-seeking community to combat censorship. People ask all the time how they can join the Truth Mafia. You can't just join; I have to notice you. My team and I research to ensure you have no government ties before we bring you into the family. If you'd like to get your personal decode done by Tommy Truthful and find out your role in this simulation we call life, then links are below.
🔮 The Ultimate Reading- Just $26! 🔮 For only $26, you'll receive an extensive Email Decode from Tommy himself. Just a click on the link below! https://www.truthfultv.com/book-online View all posts
Video Summary
Summary
➡ The Paranoid American podcast, launched in 2012, has been dedicated to unearthing hidden secrets of our society like MKUltra mind control, secret societies, forbidden technology, and occult symbols. The latest episode features guest Mystic Mark from "My Family Thinks I'm Crazy" podcast and operator of Alt Media United, a cooperative for alternative media podcasters. Their discussion centers on the origins and evolution of Paranoid American and the exploration of secret societies like Skull and Bones.
➡ The speaker's journey began as a delivery driver, finding oddities in his city and listening to podcasts during his work hours. This curiosity led him to begin exploring conspiracy theories and eventually introduced him to Sam Tripoli, who later gave him the opportunity to forward his interests more actively. Unsatisfied with his delivery job at Amazon, the speaker decided to dive headfirst into podcasting, resulting in the establishment of his own podcast "My Family Thinks I'm Crazy". His mission now is to elevate the genre of alternative research or conspiracy theory, which is often overlooked in the podcasting world.
➡ The speaker expresses skepticism about the commonly accepted history of Native Americans, questioning the roles and impacts of different cultures before Columbus. They further extend their skepticism to the existence of dinosaurs, believing that academia may have manipulated the truth to serve certain agendas. They suggest a potential connection between certain extinct creatures and mythical beings referenced in religious texts.
➡ The text revolved around discussing various theories including dinosaurs, flat earth and mud flood. The conversation ended smoothly by promoting paranoidamerican.com's homunculus owner's manual and thanking Sam Tripoli for generating employment within the conspiracy theory world.
➡ The speaker discusses the concept of Alt Media United, a cooperative for independent podcasters to connect, collaborate, and elevate the genre of conspiracy alternative podcasts. He emphasizes the power of unity among podcasters in face of competition and underscores the need for authenticity, audience interaction, and avoiding disparagement of other podcasts.
➡ The text discusses the fairness of podcast rankings, manipulation of download numbers through bots, and a trick for cheapening purchases by disguising product barcodes. It also delves into the possible negative impacts of self-checkouts like job loss and increasing automation which might exclude some consumers based on perceived risk. Lastly, it highlights the personal freedom that podcasting can offer.
➡ The narrator reflects on their growth and understanding of their local area and its connection to their personal identity. They express disappointment in the initial emotional manipulation they experienced following the 9/11 attacks, and discuss their journey of challenging the predominant narratives leading them towards conspiracy theories. They also remembered their early ambition to join the military and their later realization of having fallen for wartime propaganda.
➡ Mystic Mark enjoys the idea of being a police officer, despite recognizing corruption within the system. His views have evolved from anti-police sentiments due to events like Occupy Wall Street, to appreciating law and order. He acknowledges that perspective and viewpoints can change, and stresses the importance of remaining flexible and open to better reasoning, even if such changes might lead to disagreement from followers.
➡ The text covers a conversation where individuals rate their beliefs on various conspiracy theories, myths, or unknown phenomena. Simultaneously, they discuss the ambiguity of understanding good and evil, and the phenomenon of demons, suggesting that cultural context and personal behavior significantly influence one's encounters with positive or negative energies.
➡ The text discusses the potentially negative influence of occultist Aleister Crowley's work and the speaker's own personal encounters with its strange energy. The speaker argues that Crowley's autobiography and poetry, which includes questionable content, may draw certain individuals into a dark and harmful realm. Despite the lack of concrete evidence about Crowley's alleged crimes, his writings continue to resonate today due to his controversial publicity stunts, self-proclaimed wickedness, and disruptive impact on various secret societies.
➡ The text discusses the influence of Aleister Crowley, attributing his popularity to his persona being taken up by pop culture figures, like rock and roll musicians, and suggests that his ideas resonated with the counterculture of the era. Moreover, it covers how secret societies, the occult, and trends in culture have evolved over time, from 1800s seances to contemporary music and celebrity obsession. It also suggests the pharmaceutical industry's role in downplaying holistic or natural cures, contributing to a chemically-dependent society. Lastly, it asserts the idea that publicity and narcissism became pivotal parts of both Crowley's image and modern celebrity culture.
➡ The speaker discusses the concept of stardom, suggesting it has origins in Greek or Roman pantheon-like entities, and evolved into a tool for monetary gain, evidenced by figures like Elvis, The Beatles, Marilyn Monroe, and more. They discuss the rise of individuals as personal 'stars', emphasizing on Joe Rogan's authenticity and the audiences' desire for genuine content. They also touch on secret societies, psychological warfare, and the idea of awakening amidst corporate manipulation. The conversation transitions into the potential for celebrities selling their souls for fame, illuminating illusions through comedic impressions, and the importance of a straight man in comedy. The speaker expresses frustration with repeated references to the Tartaria conspiracy theory and argues for the credibility of historical records in their hometown. They end considering the possibility of historical structures being claimed rather than built by certain societies.
Video Transcription
Summary
Video TranscriptionGood evening, listeners. Brave navigators of the enigmatic and the concealed. Have you ever felt the pull of the unanswered, the allure of the mysteries that shroud our existence? For more than a decade, a unique comic publisher has dared to dive into these mysteries, unafraid of the secrets they might uncover. This audacious entity is paranoid American. Welcome to the mystifying universe of the paranoid American podcast. Launched in the year 2012, paranoid American has been on a mission to decipher the encrypted secrets of our world.
From the unnerving enigma of MKUltra mind control to the clandestine assemblies of secret societies, from the aweinspiring frontiers of forbidden technology to the arcane patterns of occult symbols in our very own pop culture, they have committed to unveiling the concealed realities that lie just beneath the surface. Join us as we navigate these intricate landscapes, decoding the hidden scripts of our society, and challenging the accepted perceptions of reality.
Folks, I've got a big problem on my hands. There's a company called Paranoid American making all these funny memes and comics. Now, I'm a fair guy. I believe in free speech as long as it doesn't cross the line. And if these AI generated memes dare to make fun of me, they're crossing the line. This is your expedition into the realm of the extraordinary, the secret, the shrouded. Come with us as we sift through the world's grand mysteries, question the standardized narratives, and brave the cryptic labyrinth of the concealed truth.
So strap yourselves in, broaden your horizons, and steal yourselves for a voyage into the enigmatic heart of the Paranoid American podcast, where each story, every image, every revelation brings us one step closer to the elusive truth. Episode number nine. We're almost in the double digits. And tonight I've got a good friend, someone that I've known for a while, a few years at least. And that is the one, the only, the majestic, the mystic mark.
What up, Mark? What's up? I love how your whole setup is concocted. You're like a video editing wizard. You had me appear through the window for the audio listeners, if there is any yet. Yep, there I am in the window. I love it. I'm like the Peeping Tom on this podcast, but I just want to point out how freaking sick your video intro is. I mean, that's probably the best intro to any podcast I've ever seen.
Kudos. That's high praise. That's high praise from you, especially since you're the podcast guy, right? I could probably have you sit here and just list, like, 100 podcasts off the top of your head, and that wouldn't even be all of them. I might be able to do that, but I will say it's impressive. I was sitting here thinking, all right, how much do I need to pay Thomas to get me one of those? Basically? But, hey, you got your own style.
I love it. This is so cool. And 2012 is when Paranoid American started I didn't know that. And I'm glad the intro mentioned it because that's around the same time I kind of got into all this stuff. That's when I graduated from high school, actually, it was 2012. So I don't know what that says about my generation, but it definitely felt apocalyptic, to say the least. But we're already rolling here in the intro.
Let me stop interrupting you and let you get on that's nuts, because actually, I started in 2006, if I'm being honest. But I didn't get serious, and I couldn't get any of my comics published. So in 2012, I said, I'm going to stop trying to reach out to other publishers who keep laughing at me or thinking I'm insane or thinking I'm like, a crazy and just do it myself.
But this isn't about me. This is about Mystic Mark. And as a quick introduction, My Family Thinks I'm Crazy is an incredibly entertaining podcast, all kinds of interesting guests constantly. You also have you're the guy, you know everybody in the community, because I think you also run Alt Media United, which is kind of this big. I don't want to call it a conglomeration because it sounds a little too corporate, but it's like a huge cooperative of sort of alt Media podcasters, hence the name.
So I wanted to let you describe my family thinks I'm crazy. Describe Mystic Mark and describe Alt Media United a little bit. Yeah. Well, thanks, Thomas. I appreciate you inviting me. Here a little look behind the scenes. You actually reached out to me probably when I was only 50 episodes in. It was possibly after I did Sam Tripoli's Tinfoil Hat podcast. Maybe that was where you first heard of me, or maybe it was Idiocalypse or the shows I was doing with Alex Stein back then.
But you did reach out to me, and we've been in touch since then. And I'm really grateful to have met you because not only have you come through multiple times, delivered very interesting podcasts, not only on my show, but on other shows I've booked you on, but you've provided me with some really incredible materials that I've been able to share with my audience. The Skull and Bones comic book, the MKUltra pamphlets, and a number of really interesting stickers.
So. Yeah. Geronimo's grave. It's so funny how that kind of synchronistically connected us, because for me, Geronimo and Skull and Bones, that's something like a local legend growing up where I'm from. And it took me till after high school to learn about all this stuff. Although I was interested in conspiracies, I didn't quite understand the reality of it. And it was one day in New Haven where I met a gentleman named Amos who taught me all about Skull and Bones and how they had robbed Geronimo's grave.
And sure enough, however many years later, ten years later, I meet you, and you've published a comic book literally portraying the whole incident. And I've actually taken one of those comic books and folded it the way, like, the Jehovah's Witness will leave something in the seal of your door. I took one of those comic books and I put it in between the two doors of the Skull and Bones tomb.
So I don't know who found that, but fingers crossed. Maybe that's a part of their little memorabilia now. Or maybe they have it on display. Maybe they threw it in the trash. Who knows? But yeah, Skull and Bones, that's a subject that I've been maybe that's why I can't fly on planes anymore. Oh, God. Yeah. I put you on their watch list. I'm sorry. I didn't think about that.
I'm like, oh, shit, that has Thomas's name in it and all that. Hopefully I ripped the back cover out so there was no it's such a common name. So many people have the last name. It's it's very typical. Well, if that is your gnome deplore, you picked a very good one because that's vague and maybe we'll never know Thomas's real name, but that's funny you say that because I remember the first time you were on my podcast, episode 44.
I'm pretty sure we just called you the Paranoid American. I don't know if we even said your full name, but yeah, either way, that's a long way of going about explaining that. I've been interested in this stuff for a long time, and there was a number of synchronicities that occurred during a delivery job that I had in New Haven that really pushed me into I don't know. It's funny because now I think about it a little differently, but then it was all very exciting, like, wow, this is so marvelous that I have this opportunity to be, like, an know journalist or detective or whatever you want to call it at Yale University because it is such an insulated place.
If you're not a student there, you can't just wander through the buildings. You might be able to go in the library, you might be able to walk around campus a bit. But as an outsider in a place that felt like it was a part of where, you know, it's like, hey, why can't I explore this magnificent place? And having a job at this bakery allowed me to do that.
And I found myself in all these different buildings within the Yale campus. I even went inside of the former lodge where the wolfshead Secret Society met. They have a new building now, but I was in their former building. And on the day George H. W. Bush died, I realized that every Tuesday I had been delivering pastries in his former home. And I realized that because I looked down at the newspaper and it said, george H.
W. Bush died today. And it said, former resident of New Haven, 88 Hill House Avenue. And that was the same address of the building I was standing in as I read that. So, I mean, there was a number of synchronicities like that that just kind of smacked me across the face. But it was so funny because that pastry spot in particular where we would deliver pastries to, it wasn't like a cafe or anything.
A lot of my deliveries were to cafes. This was to a mathematics or economics department. And they wanted, like, coffee and pastries delivered for their staff every Tuesday morning. And the janitor was so fed up with having to let me in while he was vacuuming because I would bang on the door, let me in. So he taught me how to break into this building. So every Tuesday, I would hop a wall, go around to the front, open it up, put the pastries in, and leave.
And sure enough, I find out some months later that I had been doing this in the home where George H. W. Bush and George Bush, Jr. Were living when they lived in New Haven. Like this was one of George W. Bush's childhood that's you were jumping the just like and I thought to myself, jeez, I wonder how many times they sat and ate in this courtyard here that I was, like, jumping a wall to get, you know, number of synchronicities like that.
Seeing weird things like people going in and out of the secret society buildings. People going in and out of what looked like tunnels. Hearing rumors of homeless people falling into tunnels and never coming back. I mean, there's a lot of weird things going on in New Haven, and I started to become very fascinated. And luckily for me, being a delivery driver, I had tons of time to listen to podcasts.
And I gravitated towards Sam, Tripoli's, Tinfoil Hat, the Higher Side, chats Grammarica show, among others. And I went to go see Sam Tripoli in New York City. I gave him a copy of the Caballion, which is the seven hermetic principles. And that just kind of was a key into this other realm. Like, giving him that book unlocked this kind of podcast for me, or at least the possibility of it.
Not that it wasn't possible before, but I really think of that as a turning point because I had a conversation with Sam very briefly. I gave him the book. I gave him this interesting pouch made out of faraday fabric, and he was just like, know. And that got me a chance to go on his podcast sometime after. You know, I'd always had a knack for this kind of stuff, and I'd always kind of talked about weird conspiracy theories with my friends.
And I think Sam kind of picked that up in me, and he noticed that in me. And he asked me to do a spot on his new spiritual podcast called Zero. So I joined him. I told him about my thoughts on spirituality and synchronicity and how that had guided me through my life up until that point. And still to this day. And it was weird. He says, oh, I don't know who I'm going to have next on this podcast.
Who do you think I should have next on this podcast? And I'm like, oh, I'll email you. I emailed him a list like 20 names long. And he's like, hey, maybe I should hire you to do this for me part time. And if you're good at it, I'll have you do it full time because I'm getting busier and busier. It's harder and harder to book guests for all these shows I'm doing.
So one thing led to another, and I ended up working really closely with, you know, now I just went and saw him this past weekend. He did a show out here where I live in Connecticut. Got to meet Eddie, Bravo and Xavier for the first time, which was cool. But all of that was, again, so synchronistic. Like, wow, what are the ODS that Sam asked me to do that.
And I had had a podcast at that time called The Bud Triangle, which the concept was that me and my two friends, the three of us, were sitting in a triangle smoking bud. And I told them about conspiracies. Because you got to think about it, in 2018, 2017, a lot of people were still in that old mindset of like, no conspiracies. That's stuff you see in movies, that's stuff you see in comic books, that's stuff you see in video games, but it doesn't really happen in real life.
Sure, there's Internet rumors about it, but it doesn't really happen in real life. But with Trump, people started to actually consider it because they saw weird shit going on. Trump was saying weird shit, QAnon, like, things that a president had never said before, things that had never happened on that stage before were happening. So I saw that as an opportunity to get my friends in on this and talk to them about it.
And I was obsessed with podcasts. I was like, I need to start a podcast. But then I eventually gave that name up, the Bud Triangle. Because I told my family, I'm like, hey, I'm going to quit my job. And they are so excited at this point that I was an Amazon delivery driver. Because back then too, Amazon was like, billion dollar company. You can make $18 an hour working for Amazon.
Come on, change your life. Like, I was one of those guys that got into their scheme because they hired like, hundreds of people in that time period that I got hired at Amazon. So I started delivering packages at Amazon. My family's stoked. They're like, oh, wow, he's finally got, like, a job that seems good. And then I turn to him. I'm telling him I'm going to quit to work for some guy who lives in Los Angeles.
And they're scratching their head like, how is that a good thing? Talking about the world's in a pandemic, right? You that's stupid. And truthfully, I was fed up with my job because they were doing the stupid laser test every time we got into the building to see if we were sick and made us wear masks as we're moving all this heavy stuff around. So I was fed up.
I quit that job, and I said, fuck it. I have this opportunity with Sam. I'm going to dive headfirst. I'm going to start my own podcast, and my family thinks I'm crazy. That phrase hit me when I told my family about my new decision. So I'm like, oh, shit. My family thinks I'm crazy. And I'm thinking about that, and I'm like, oh, that's a name of a podcast.
That's my podcast name. And I told Sam and he said, oh, yeah, that sounds cool. And that's how it all started. I mean, I've come a long way since started off just doing it, literally sitting down with my friend in a room around a microphone. And now I have a RODECaster and a Rode mic and a nice laptop. And that's all, really, thanks to Sam Tripoli and the people that tuned into my show early on.
Sure, I was lucky to get onto his platform and be exposed to more people than I would have if I just started off by myself on my own. But I think the synchronicity had to happen. And that's just how my life works, and I think there's a science to it. I might not have figured it out totally, but I think something in me knew when I was young, you can quit college because this is going to work out for you if you stick with what you like, if you do what you like.
And I'd been really into the law of attraction stuff around that time, too. And plus, I had some friends who told me that I would get my student loan debt forgiven. They're like, oh, yeah, I know this thing. You write these papers and you get your student loan debt forgive. You just got to vote for Bernie. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that was part of it too, I'm sure. And that never happened.
I ended up paying my student loan debt off, but luckily, I only had about a year and a half of debt to pay. So all that aside, I really believe in that entrepreneurial sort of spirit, taking the opportunities that are in front of you and bending them into a better one. That's kind of what I did with the delivery jobs. I took that as an opportunity to get paid, to learn.
And I just listened to so many podcasts that by the time I had an opportunity to do a podcast, I was so ready because I had heard what everyone else was talking about. I knew who I wanted to talk to on the podcast. And I still haven't even come close to hitting, like, 50% of that list of people that I initially set out to interview because there's tons of people that have inspired me on my bookshelf here, so many interesting authors that I want to talk to on my show.
So I appreciate you saying that. Up at the top, you said, I interview some really interesting people. That means a lot to me because I do try to have some standard for who I let on the show. And yeah, Alt Media United is kind of like the realization that nobody is trying to elevate this genre. As far as Spotify, Apple, like, the podcast aggregators, they're not going to ever create a genre called conspiracy theory or alternative research, right? You're just not going to see that.
You got history, you got philosophy, you got comedy, you got the main genres, and that's it. So I thought, why don't we have a website where everybody could just put their podcast? And if people want to hear more interesting conspiracy alternative podcasts, they could go there to learn about new ones. If they hear about Tinfoil Hat or they hear about my show, and then they go and find Alt Media United and they say, oh, Tinfoil Hat is connected to all these other shows in a way.
And albeit the only thing that connects us is that we're doing these shows independently. Nobody in the cooperative is a part of some giant podcast corporation. It's not like we have one of those generic podcasts that you hear that always make it curiously into the top ten, top 20. That's the kind of stuff that we're up against. And I feel like Alt Media United, the reason we're cooperative is because if we cooperate with one another, we can all elevate this genre of entertainment to a professional level where people who are good at it can make money and work with each other, rely on each know.
And that was motivated in part a big way by Sam Tripoli and all the philosophy he sort know, he kind of generated surrounding the podcast like Tinfoil Hat and Union of the Unwanted, like that whole ethos of, like, we could do this together. Yeah, the algorithm doesn't want us. Yeah, they're censoring us. Yeah, they're suppressing us. But at the end of the day, if we band together, they can't stop us.
And you see it now where I think most people are fairly awake to the issues that are most important to us. I mean, yes, there are distractions, yes, there's division and diversions and all this other propagandized crap. But I think for the most part, thanks to the know, we are waking up at an unprecedented level. And I don't think that it's an accident that there are so many conspiracy.
Like me and Juan sometimes will talk shit to each other, like, oh, your podcast is and my podcast, blah, blah, blah, because we like the competitive rap battle. We like the faux competitiveness because that's just how we are geared. But in all reality, I've helped Juan out a lot. He's helped me out a lot. We've both made our audience aware of each other. So now Sam tripoli, I heard Juan being talked about on Broken SIM today with Johnny.
And, you know, and I think that's awesome to hear that I'm not like, oh, they should be talking about me. I'm like, fuck yeah. Juan's, awesome. Talk about Juan. He's great. He's doing great research. So that's the kind of thing that more people need to do. And if they're listening to this right now and they're like, shit, my podcast isn't on Alt Media United. All you got to do is email me because that's as easy as it is.
It's also very email address. Let me just drop the email address. Yeah, altmediaunited@gmail. com. And yeah, it's just as easy to join as it is to get asked to leave if you don't cooperate with others. If you're talking shit about other podcasts, that's a pretty easy way for us to say, now, we're not going to have you a part of this because you're not really that cooperative. But there is a lot of beef in the podcast world, isn't there? It's kind of weird.
Well, it's at levels, it's people who fight with other podcasts. They usually fight with podcasts who have the same amount of listeners as them, you know what I mean? Or they're punching up and they're trying to take shots at somebody that maybe they're a little envious of. But yeah, like rap battles, man. It reminds me the same exact dynamics of a rap battle where you don't ever punch down because if you ever lose in that situation, you just put it all on the line for what? To punch down at someone.
And now you basically switch positions with them. So I don't know. I think that there's something really interesting with the entertainment and the competitive aspect. And man, podcasting is almost like competitive talking. It's like a sport. Yeah, it's interesting that it can feel that way. I think that's more so the case with YouTube shows and shows that are on YouTube because there's more comments and interactions with the fans and they can be sort of charged up into being really into a show because they love being in that fight mentality of like, oh yeah, f that podcast, or we love this podcast.
Do you think that there could be some online audiences that convert into cults at some point? I think that's already the case. I mean, there's definitely cult following around certain podcasts for sure. And it doesn't appear to make much sense to others who see whichever show they might not like and be like, how could anybody watch this? But then there's millions of people that do. So that's a cult in a way.
There's like an ASMR might be like a cult that's rising up and we don't even realize it. And then one day they're going to say, know a meteor is going to pass over Earth and everyone that listens to ASMR has to drink this special potion. Yeah, I'm just glad celebrities don't seem to do very well in podcasting, aside from the comedian. Celebrities who have made a really good niche out of podcasting and actually, I think brought more people to podcasting than any other genre is really comedy podcasts.
But yeah, no, I'm just glad celebrities aren't doing well in podcasting because it just shows that people are interested in authenticity and that's something that television departed from, I think, a few decades ago. And now we have the majority of people who probably are entertained more by sure streaming sites, but things like YouTube and podcasting are creeping into that percentage wise. So people I mean, me, myself, I listen to only podcasts.
I mean, barely do I sit down and watch the podcast on YouTube. It's really only I make an exception for like Kill Tony, which you got to watch it. If you only listen to it, I think you might be missing out. But with certain podcasts, it seems like, yeah, there's a huge cult following. And I like to think that I've figured out some ways to make my show really unique and I've seen success by doing that.
But I noticed that the podcasts that do well are the ones that interact a lot with their audience. Yeah, there are big exceptions to that. But I do notice that audience interaction is a big thing. So in that respect, who knows, maybe in 1020 years we'll see actual cults developing out of things that were initially just like virtual or online. I think I might hear what you've seen as audience interactions that you thought were really clever in podcast world.
Well, it's interesting because yeah, I do this for the love of it because I am interested in all these subjects. And the fact that I can actually make money doing this is a really big thing for me because that's a part of it. It's like millions, I hear like tens of millions. What do you mean that's how much you can make in the conspiracy podcast world? I mean, depends on who you're talking about.
I don't know about that. Jeez, maybe. I don't know. That's funny. It's actually you brought up a really good mean. I was kind of joking about that a little bit, but yeah, I remember back in the day when you would go to Barnes and Noble and they for sure had a paranormal occult section and it was usually tucked away or upstairs or something with a bunch of other true crime and kind of undesirable topics.
But they had the section and you could almost always guarantee you'd go up there and find someone else that was, I don't know, maybe wearing jinkos or had black nail polish or something, right. But it kind of drew people to it and you knew that that was the section that had this kind of stuff in it. And in the podcast world, it is weird that that section doesn't necessarily still exist the way that it used to in old bookshops.
I don't know. And I think that there's definitely something noble and worthwhile of trying to carve that sort of category back out society as a whole within podcasting, within everything. So it's not just relegated to this old forgotten isle of Barnes and Noble where people aren't even going to know what the hell that is pretty soon. Right, right. Well, I think Barnes and Noble knows how successful those books, how well those books do, and how there are cult followings for those books and they consistently sell.
But it is funny. You can learn a lot about the owner of a bookshop by seeing what they don't shelve because I've gone into bookshops where you get only a few conspiracy books and they're all hidden in the history section or you get some conspiracy books and they're all shoved in with the new age books. Know. Very rarely do I come across a bookshop that has a really good section on that.
But surprisingly, Barnes and Noble consistently, because it's a corporation, has a good selection of those sorts of books. So, yeah, that's a good point. But to your point, much like the section at Barnes and Noble, it's off near the bathroom or it's off in some weird corner where you wouldn't expect it. And I think the same is true with the algorithm on YouTube and even Spotify and these other podcast apps where you go and look at the top charts or what they're suggesting.
It's typically not shows like this. There are exceptions to that and shows that break through. And I think Apple that's one of their saving graces is that they are pretty honest with the charts. Like what the charts are. They're basically how many downloads the podcast is getting. You can't get any more honest than that. Right? If the podcast is doing well, it gets to number one. Then again, you do have corporations who can buy bots to go and do fake downloads on a podcast to make it look like it's doing much better than it.
And they do, but they also have been caught a few times. I remember, man, it was probably like ten years ago, sony and Universal was doing that, and they would buy up like millions of views on their YouTube videos when an artist would drop a music video, and then they find out later that it was all bots. And then the artists technically were able to sue the labels for inflating their numbers and making them think they were doing a It's a Funny World where they'll just pay because it's just a marketing cost.
Right. If I can pay is X amount. I don't know if you remember Obama and Bruce Springsteen had a podcast that ran for like ten episodes and they did. Just that they bought all these downloads, made it look like it was doing so well the first week it came out. And everybody who was reporting on it in the podcast realm was like, who the fuck heard of this podcast until a week ago? How does it have 100,000 or 200,000 downloads and it's only like, one episode? That's ridiculous.
And it just goes to show that, yeah, they can fake that kind of stuff. But for the most part, the fact that shows like Tinfoil Hat can make it into the top 200 and stay there for as long as they have a shows how popular a show like that is, but also shows that they're not suppressing anything in those algorithms yet. So, yeah, I think that's shout out to Nick Natoli, too, who had the Boycott Target song at the top of the charts for a while.
I was shocked that they didn't suppress that one. Put it in like a special category that you had to opt in to even see. Yeah, Sam is friends with that guy, and I don't know, I think that's his cousin or something. It's weird, but I heard about that through Sam and I still haven't heard that song. I go to Target to buy action figures, so maybe I'm revealing too much about oh, no, you haven't boycotted Target.
Do you pick up the Bud Light case on the way out, too? Well, blur my face for this, but I have been known to take advantage of those self checkout. If anybody wants a scam to scam Target, all you got to do is just rip the barcode off of a cheaper product. Like, let's say you go to the grocery aisle and you take the barcode off of a gatorade, one of those little gatorade things, the sport mixers, the drink mixes, just rip the barcode off of this, like $3.
You put that over the barcode of whatever you want, and then you ring it out and it looks like you're ringing out what you want, throw it in the bag, and you're only charging yourself $3. So maybe I'm a little bit of a scumbag for that. But hey, we're boycotting Target. So scam that target. There is an element of risk in there because I may or may not have myself been arrested specifically from Target for trying that same exact thing in the they brought me back into or allegedly, they brought my friend back into the security booth or whatever.
And again, this is like 97, 98, and they've got cameras on each of the aisles. And as the cashier would ring it up, it would show you on the security camera. Here's the thing that just got rung up. So sometimes if you could see someone checking out a TV and it's like, here's your gallon of water, it makes it really obvious. So just as a counterpoint there be extra careful.
But yeah, I highly recommend and in fact, this episode is sponsored by Stealing from Target. So if you want to support this episode and you want to support Mystic Mark, you can support us by going and stealing something from Target. Yeah, well, you could also support my podcast so I don't have to steal from Target, but I'm actually doing it out of choice, allegedly, to fight back against these automated self checkout things that are causing less jobs in the economy, leading to more homelessness.
I mean, it's a trickle down effect. Allah, Ronald Reagan. The more self checkout machines there are, the less jobs there are. It's just a fact. So although I do use the self checkout at Whole Foods because I don't like waiting in line, I boycott every other self checkout by either stealing from it or not using it. So eventually they're either going to have to give up on the self checkout or turn every store into basically like a food or item prison where you have to have a gatekeeper unlock everything for you or some kind of code where you put your credit card on and it automatically charges you to open it and take it.
I think that's where we're going to get to. I can't remember what those were called, but that was like a huge thing in the early 19 hundreds. You would go into these big room and all this food would be behind these little glasses, like little lockers, and you would buy a key to open it out and take I forgot what they were called. You can do that in Japan.
Those are very popular in Japan where it's like a vending machine store and everything's behind a vending machine. And you just walk in and slide your card and say, a, B, seven, T, seven, pick out, and it just falls. But jeez, we've really gone down a tangent here. Well, I think it's interesting just because and you were just saying that the self checkout at Whole Foods, but man, isn't Whole Foods owned by Amazon? So you're right back in the belly of the beast at that point.
And their next step is to one up the self checkout and just make it. So you walk over and grab an apple off the shelf and it's just like Mark now has one apple and you don't need to tell anyone. It just knows that you've got the apple. So, I mean, I don't think there's any use fighting that. I think the only thing that's going to happen is they're going to keep weeding out people that they deem as risks.
So then you're going to go to get that apple and the door is not going to open for Mark and it's just going to a there's a chance based on your hat and your shoes and the way that your gate, that we're just going to say, no thanks, go find another shop to purchase from. Yeah, well, I think that's where we may be heading. And if that's the case, then I'm just going to do everything, like on pickup or delivery basis where someone else can shop for me and then just send the groceries to my house.
Yeah, I don't want to be in that cart. Yeah, but hey, this is the electronic world we're heading to. I feel like it's ironic because the podcast, it's gotten me enmeshed in many ways in the system, so to speak. Like the Internet system and using the Internet, my face, my likeness, and all this stuff is on public display on the Internet. But at the same time, my actual life, I mean, I'm freer than ever.
I don't have a boss. Technically, I work for Sam, but he's not much of a boss. He's a friend more than he's a yeah. Yeah, I think that's the blessing. I really appreciate people for allowing me to take this journey by supporting the podcast, because that's the biggest thing I gleamed from podcasting, was how I could free myself from this BS system that I felt like was just oppressing me and leaving me depressed.
Not to say that my life wasn't fun or interesting or good. I really enjoy life, for sure, but working every day was just not my thing. Whose thing is it? I'd rather be working on a farm. I've done that before. That's fulfilling, right? But the work I was doing previous to driving was not really fulfilling. Driving was great, but at the end of the day, this takes the cake.
I mean, I'm sitting here talking to friends like you and learning about all this stuff, researching it. This is what I think I was destined to do in some way. And I think the way I can give back is by learning about my local area and trying to really figure out what's going on around here, because this is where it started for me, and I found a lot of people are inspired by that.
And luckily for them, it leads them to their own synchronicities by taking a newfound appreciation from where they're from, the land, the history, these stories start to pull you in, and next thing you know, you become a part of the story. I think that's what's so cool about researching this stuff, particularly when it connects to where you're from or where you live, your family, your ancestry, and all those threads that make us a unique person.
You mentioned in 2012, you were basically just getting out of high school, or you were in high school. I'm curious. You don't have to say your exact age, but I'm assuming you were fairly young when 911 happened. What was your initial reaction to 911 when it first happened? And I'm curious, when was your first big conspiracy moment when you were like, Illuminati is real, skull and Bones is real? 911 was an inside job.
So I'm 28. I'll be 29 in October. So I was like seven years old. When 911 happened, and I was in second or third grade, and they told us that class was over and we had to go into the library, and we went to the library and we watched the news as a group, and then we went home and it was really weird. And I'm sure that's a familiar story to anyone my age within, like, five or ten years.
Because yeah, I've heard that other people say that where they were in school because it was a Tuesday and the classes were closed and they made everybody go into an auditorium or a library or whatever to watch the news, which I thought was interesting in hindsight. Like, well, if the nation's at war now because there was just an attack, why are you going to expose all the kids to that? Don't you want these kids to go home and feel at least somewhat comfortable and not like there's about to be a dangerous war and we all might die? It didn't seem logical at that age.
So that never sat right with me. So then I became pretty patriotic, like, oh yeah, we got to fight these Iraqis and we got to work. The programming worked. Yeah, exactly. We got to find Osama bin Laden. And I remember watching Fox News with my parents, or Christmas, like 2001, that Christmas, my parents were glued to the TV because all the soldiers were going off. This was like peak O'Reilly years too, right? Soldiers were going off to Iraq or whatever.
I don't remember exactly the specific circumstances, but they were interviewing soldiers who were in the Middle East and always a big deal because it was Christmas and they weren't going to be home for the holidays because now we're in this big war. So I was pretty sympathetic to that cause, and I just thought about it over the years as I got older, and I started to realize, like, oh, my grandparents and my father and these people that watch the news and repeat these talking points and this rhetoric, this isn't their own thoughts.
They're not actually thinking these things through because when I started to have a little the smallest whiff of dissent, I was immediately smashed for my contrary opinion. So that was a big red flag for me as a young, inquisitive, curious person, because I'm like, is this within your family or within your school or everything? Anything? I'm not really speaking to a specific circumstance, but I remember having conversations with my grandfather, my mother, my father, anybody that I was near the news around.
Or sometimes you'd be at a gas station, you'd hear people overhear someone having a conversation like, oh yeah, we need to kill all these brown people. I live in Connecticut. It's a blue state as far as voting goes, but there's tons of Republicans here, and tons of people, despite political allegiance, felt that way during that time. So to me it felt like, oh, these people aren't really thinking for themselves.
They're sort of just getting emotionally agitated. And that's where a lot of this is coming from because they would just get really upset. I think it was like family parties, uncles, or I'd hear people have these conversations about that and I'd be like, well, I just raised a contrary point of view. And that would just get people upset. And I remember really regretting having so much fervor around, like, oh, yeah, we need to get Osama bin Laden.
Because I was what? As I got older, like 2006, seven came around, I think around then, I was in middle school and I watched Loose Change, which was a documentary about 911 that came out, was edited a number of times. And it's funny, I actually interviewed Jason Burmis, who, although he wasn't the only person part of it, he claims that he basically made the best version of Loose Change.
So, I don't know. I've heard similar from I think his name's Dylan Avery. I went to school with him when I was in elementary school in upstate New York. Yeah. Wow. Isn't that crazy? Another synchronicity. Yeah. That's interesting. Yeah. I don't know exactly who the people were, but they were fairly young. I remember hearing their voices on the documentary and thinking like, oh, these are people my age doing it.
Was that and then Zeitgeist, too. That was the other big one. Around that same time. Yeah. This girl that I sat next to in math class, I had a crush on her, and I think she might have liked me back because she suggested that I watched Zeitgeist. I always remembered, oh, that's awesome. That would be like, love it. At first sight of someone, if like, oh, you should check out Zeitgeist.
It's like one of those memes, I had no game back then, but that certainly was a good sign. If I had game, I should have followed up with that. But no giving her one of those 911, I'm falling for you cards, and she probably would have dug it. I've never heard of that, but I might know, add those to the shop soon. Oh, cool. So, yeah, all that to say, it kind of dawned on me afterwards that there was a lot of wartime propaganda that I fell for.
And I got into martial arts, and for a moment when I was a kid, I was into military stuff. I thought I would join the military. I had, like, Airsoft guns and I printed out, like, Osama bin Laden targets out of my grandparents printer. And you were going to karate chop the shit out of him, weren't you? No, I wasn't doing karate chops. I was doing, like, sniper practice with my Airsoft paper.
You took martial arts too, right? But yeah, I would try to chop pieces of wood and dumb shit like that. But eventually I had, like, a heavy bag that I hung from a tree in my backyard. But that was much later, after well into, because Obama was in office for me through high school. I think around high school, he got elected. Did the school celebrate that? At meant to.
We were made to watch that, too. His inauguration, which we weren't ever made to watch. Bush's inauguration in school, well, this was historic. It was the first president of color in history, right? And also allegedly the first gay president, too. But we don't have not the first CIA president, though. Well, he might not be the first gay president, now that I say that. I mean, jeez the people in this 1718 hundreds.
It's a spectrum, man. It's a spectrum. What are you going to do? You throw a dart? We might have another gay president if Joe Biden runs again. But anyways oh, wait, he is the president. So anyways, what were we talking about? Well, actually, this is the perfect time to segue into some rapid fire questions, but I want to start it out with one very important question, and there is a right answer to this one.
It's not a trick question. Mystic Mark, are you a cop? Because if you're a cop, you have to tell me. Would a cop smoke his are you a cop? I do on a podcast. That could be fake weed. I don't know. No, I'm pretty sure it's not fake weed. I think you've got the good shit. If I was a cop, wouldn't I say right away that I'm not a cop? Are you trying to play some double reverse psychology on me, sir? That's something that a cop might do.
Just saying. If I was a cop, this podcast would be a pretty good cover if I was trying to investigate some sort of podcast drug ring or something like that. The online waco. Yeah, start shipping people defunct grenade shells. That would be a really poor decision on the part of whatever department hired me to send me in as a mole for Sam Tripoli's podcast. If I was trying to get in with anybody, I think Sam Tripoli is not the way to do it.
I love Sam. Sam's amazing. But he has exposed his intentions and his beliefs enough to where yeah, there's no moles in the tinfoil hat podcast. But no, I'm not a cop. If I was, let the record show that Mystic Mark declared he is not a cop 805 Eastern. But I have ideas of being a cop. That would be fun. I mean, not that I believe in police. I do believe there's a lot of corruption in police forces, and I would like to see an end to know.
I live in a blue state on the East Coast, so there's a lot of bullshit that goes on. And sometimes I'm like, if I was a cop right now, I'd be pulling that motherfucker over, or whatever the case may be. Sometimes I'm like, yeah, I wish I was a cop right now. My girlfriend makes fun of me because she's like, oh, you're such a do good or you're such a rule follower.
And I'm like, what are you talking about? I don't have a real job, I'm basically out of the system. What are you talking about? But no, I like cops. I'm not a cop though. Well, I don't know a rule follower is the right way to describe it. But even as you were saying a little bit earlier, that the way that the school kind of showed you the 911, right? And you were thinking later that logically didn't make sense to you and you could never really resolve it.
And that sort of added to that feeling of deception or some kind of manipulation, I assume. And I think that might be part of that same facet. Right. It's not that you need rules, but that you think in logical terms of like action, consequence, what actually makes sense for all of these things to happen. So sometimes that can be sort of misconstrued as being a rule follower, but really it's more like having a comfort, having a system to work by that things don't just arbitrarily change and get subjective.
Yeah, I agree with that. I've always been very scientifically minded. I had an affinity for classification of animals and plants. I know every animal. If you show me a picture of an animal, any animal, I could probably tell you what name. But anyways, if I could append your question earlier before you asked me if I was a cop, another kind of wake up for me. And this relates to the cop thing.
Not that that was a serious question, but the whole Occupy Wall Street thing happened around the time that I graduated from high school and just after I had graduated from high school and I went into college that same year. 2012, the fall of 2012. The green, the center of the downtown New Haven. Historically it's always been a place where people are allowed to come to protest, practice free speech.
So after Occupy Wall Street, there was a ton of people that they kind of lived in these homeless camps in certain places that they occupied and the Green was one of them. So there was like a spillover of those types of people that were around during that time period that kind of influenced me to be a little bit more anarchistic and free thinking and like fuck the police type mentality.
Smash the Starbucks. And that's another thing that kind of now I think twice about in the same way that I was like I kind of fell for the war propaganda at a very young age and then I wised up to it. I kind of think of police as like, sure there are corrupt polices, police officers, there's corrupt police forces, there's whole towns that are controlled by corrupt police.
Sure, I've had my run ins with the police. I've been put in a holding cell once I've done things, I'm not the perfect person. I've never hurt anybody, but I definitely had my run ins with cops. I could hate cops from that position, but I don't, because I see that there are good cops and that for the most part, I'd rather live in a country where there's order and that bad guys get arrested for doing things like hurting people or breaking in houses or selling drugs that kill people and leave people basically poisoned mentally and physically.
So, yeah, I do like cops now. Whereas if you ask me what I thought about the police when Bernie Sanders was running for president, I would have been like, f the police and throw on, like, let's. Yeah, I definitely have grown to think about my thoughts in hindsight, and I think that's a good thing when some people they don't like, especially now you're having a podcast, you put your opinions out there and then people change their mind over time.
And maybe that doesn't sit right with people who listen to these podcasts and like, oh, I loved your podcast because I agreed with you and now I don't agree with you. And it's like, well, maybe that means that you need to grow up too, or maybe that means you need to change, too, and hey, we might not have the same change, but that I'm changing, right? And I think that's important for everybody to have that flexibility to be able to change their mind on a topic or an opinion or perspective if better reasoning comes along to show you otherwise.
I don't think there's anything wrong with having an opinion. But yeah, I've definitely had moments where I've looked back and said, like, I was really wrong about that, and I like that. I especially like having those moments on the podcast. I think that shows people that, oh, maybe I don't know everything, so don't go emailing me and saying, like, well, you need to do blah, blah, blah. It's like, hey, I'm not perfect.
I'm not going to get everything right. But also, it's a good point because I think in this community, too, sort of like in the scientific community, there's certain people that have almost made their career on certain perspectives and viewpoints. And I kind of feel like sometimes in the back of my head, even if they change their mind on something, let's say that Flat Earth was your thing, right, and you just made it your thing and you became an authority on it? What happens if you've got a huge following and a patreon and subscribers and they all want to talk about how they agree with you on Flat Earth? If you were to change your mind, are you ready to give all that up or would you just keep playing the act? Yeah, exactly.
Just lean into it and becomes like a thing. Like wrestling. Yeah. And I don't want to speak on anybody specifically because I have friends that believe in flat earth and one of the first podcasts I ever recorded was with my friend Reva who lives on a farm and lives by the Bible. She lives by what it says in the Bible and one of her beliefs that she cannot be shaken on no matter what is that the earth is flat.
And I respect the hell out of her for that because it's made her life better. Maybe not that aspect specifically, but just living by the Bible and everything that comes with that has made her life better. I mean, I envy her lifestyle. Her and her family own a dairy farm and it's a beautiful situation to live in. But yeah, it's an interesting thing to your point. I think the internet has this aspect to it where you can find yourself in a silo.
And I've found one particular YouTuber who hey, everybody has a past. Maybe he's changed. Sure. But there's one guy in particular, he's done some pretty weird shit in the past and it's public information now. Other YouTubers have talked about it, but he's got like this cult following and some people were like, oh, you should have this guy on your podcast. And I had to make the decision like, okay, do I want to have this guy on or do I not? And ultimately the thing that from his past did factor in a little bit because that's the type of person I am where if I know something about you that I don't like, I might not like you.
And that's just my character. I don't know. Wait, but you'll deliver pastries to a genocidal war criminal? Man. This this guy here yale University's economic Department. Although it is weird that they are in the former home of the Bush department. I don't know that there are any Bush people that but that I mean, I might argue that Yale's Economic Department could be even worse than the well, I did say earlier that know not the best person, but yeah, that's a good point.
Maybe I shouldn't throw stones at Glass house. Well, this was an awesome sort of concept that changing your mind in this kind of category. It's weird. Like saying community is such a weird thing because it doesn't always feel like an actual community. It's just like a shared interest. But in this community, changing your mind about certain topics feels a little more rare than it should and sometimes it takes more effort.
But with that in mind, keep in mind that open flexibility and I want to figure out where you're at right now on a whole bunch of different sort of topics. So I'm going to mention something almost Rorschach style and I just want you on a scale from one to ten on how much you believe it. So if you say like a zero or a one then it just means you think it's a psyop it's nonsense.
And if it's ten, you're like, all in, and you would want to convince everybody else to be all in because you're so convinced, so makes sense. Okay. And if there's ones that you want to have to add qualifiers and like, oh, let me explain this more. Just give it like a five, and we'll circle back around to most of these. Okay, so here we go. I'm rating these on a one through five scale.
One through ten? One through ten. Five means, like, you're on the fence. Okay. Was Bob Marley assassinated? Ten. Absolutely. Do you think there's hidden treasure on Oak Island? Depends on your definition of treasure. Buried pirate gold. I'm glad this is a scale, because I would say six for this one. Okay. Was the Black Plague engineered by ancient elites of the time? Seven. Okay. Are chupacabras real? Four. Do you think Jack the Ripper's identity was covered up by the British monarchy? Yes.
Ten. Do you think Big Pharma hides natural cures to maximize profits? Absolutely. The correct answer there would have been 20 or 30. Is the Patterson gimlin bigfoot footage genuine? Well, you were there last time. I talked about it with Nate for Reality Stars when you guys were more convinced when I showed you the stabilized footage. Yeah, you showed me this footage, and although I don't remember how everybody else felt, and I tend to be somewhat of a pushover, although I don't like to admit that, but if other people present me with a pretty good opinion, I can waiver, but that still sticks with me.
That was one of the first times I ever really saw something outside of the norm. Like when I was reading Ripley's Believe It or not in my elementary school library, and I saw the still image of one of the frames from that footage in Ripley's Believe It or not, and I just looked at it. I was like, whoa, that's a real animal. I just always thought that was a real because it was in Ripley's.
Well, the image, it just always struck me as that's an like, as I said earlier, I love animals. If you show me any animal, aside from sea creatures for the most part, and insects, I can identify pretty much any animal. So are we talking six? Are we talking ten here? I'm talking specifically the Patterson gimlin footage. Not bigfoot as a whole, but the Patterson gimlin footage in particular.
All right, so then I did learn some things that call it into question, so I'm going to go with seven, which is much lower. Okay, that still sounds like it's pretty credible. Okay. Did werewolves exist within the last 500 years? And by werewolf, I mean, like, a truly shape shifting now you're a wolf, now you're a person, now you're a wolf kind of deal. Yeah. 1010. Do governments already possess free energy technology and they're just suppressing it from us? Yeah, of course.
What else. Are those UFOs? Ten. Can you harvest energy from crystals alone and not like lasers, but can you just go out and farm crystals? Is that a 1010? And then finally, did Alastair Crowley really talk to an alien and or, um, I'm going to say he definitely talked to a demon. So if we're going to say demon, then, yeah, eight demon. Eight. So I want to start on that one and work backwards a little bit because I'm truly fascinated at the concept of angels and demons and good and evil, especially as objective things.
Because just like you were mentioning, everything has to fit a certain logic and make kind of sense. Once you start talking about true evil or true good, it feels like that. And there's this realm of subjectiveness. So I want to just understand first, are you religious when you talk about demon? Are you talking about a Christian version of a demon or do you interpret demons as some other kind of entity? That's the thing.
I don't think about it in terms of Christian or the other. Maybe this could be simply answered with just a yes. But I would say that regardless of your cultural context, they exist. If Christians have studied it and have information about it, I treat that as equal to what a shaman in a tribe would say, let's say in Siberia or South America or Africa or Australia or North America, like even Europe.
There are groups everywhere, literally all seven continents, who have lore, rituals, experiences with entities that they describe in a number of mean. I recently talked to Paul Staubbs, who's convinced that they're all connecting with the nephilim. When they say ancestor, I mean, regardless of what they mean by ancestors, there's clearly something that people let into their psyche and they let that possess them. And we have other versions of that where people are possessed against their will and maybe things start to manifest in their life that lead to illness or misfortune.
People have had those experiences throughout time. I don't think there's any discounting that it's just people don't like to believe it because it's uncomfortable. And I think, unfortunately, the way you live your life, whether it's behavior that's learned or genetic, I think some people, they just have a propensity to attract negativity and they live maybe a life that's harder than someone who has the opposite effect, where they attract positivity.
I think there's ways of even reversing it where maybe you're a very negative person and something changes and now you have a more positive turn in life and your karma or your destiny or however you want to term it changes. But I think these beings, whatever they are, demons, I don't think it's necessarily a religious context because every religion talks about some form of or another of this.
So I think when it comes down to it, there are ways to live your life correctly, healthily, and avoid those types of beings. And I think those types of beings take advantage of us when we are not living our life in a correct or healthy way. A correct being definitely on a spectrum, there's not one way to live your life. But as far as the seven deadly sins or what you should and shouldn't do is pretty established across the world, right? So I think demons, they gravitate to people who commit murder and things like well, maybe there's one example that's somewhat famous from not Jordan Maxwell, though.
I love Jordan Maxwell from Joseph Campbell. And he mentions I think this was a Marco Polo book, but he goes to or it might have been a different historian. He goes to a foreign land and he sees at a funeral the family of the deceased is eating their body and he thinks these people are devils, they're demons. This is like the most disgusting thing that how could you possibly not venerate your dead? Why aren't you treating it with more respect? And they were like, well, this is how we respect the dead.
What do you guys do? What do you mean? You just bury it in the ground and let it waste away? What about all of the knowledge and the wisdom that needs to be transferred to the rest of the family and passed down so clearly, culturally, something as horrific as maybe cannibalism could be seen as a good thing aside from Kuru and getting like a protein in your brain that eats it away and turns it into mush.
But I don't think the morality version of that was evil. But the point being made from that story was that when he went back and told all of his Christian sort of family and friends and everybody else that they thought that was just absolute Satan, right? Like nothing but Satan would be causing someone to do that and it was just this know, disconnect. So, I mean, I'm curious in that regard.
But I also want to ask you, since you're familiar with Alistair Crowley, you've talked about him a few times and read a lot of his stuff. Do you think that someone that was secular atheist agnostic could go and pick up Crowley's work, read through it and successfully summon a demon? Or do you think you'd actually have to do horrible things and become a negative person and actually become evil in order to attract the evil? Or do you think, know, magical incantations and rituals and sigils and stuff could bring you there alone? Well, I think people have a Hollywood version of what they think of as, like, demon and evil.
Well, it shoots laser eyes out of its eyes. That's basically no, but I think, yeah, evil can manifest in ways that you don't recognize. Like, you can become a version of yourself that you never wanted to be. That's a version of evil where you neglect yourself or you neglect others. You abuse yourself or you abuse others. I think that's a form of evil. And maybe people who take a sort of negative vibration in life and stick with that cord end up attracting something that agrees with that negative vibration and then manifests more of it in that person's life in like a parasitic know I think in that sense, Alistair Crowley's books could yes, perfectly.
Like if you follow the recipe perfectly, maybe, you know, do something that know, an atheist would then kind of have like a revelation from and be like, oh, there must be something more. Now that's possible. But I don't think that someone like that would have the same result as somebody who was naive or innocent or had a magical mindset. I think those people actually shouldn't interact with this kind of stuff because those are kind of like the people who are to use my name in vain.
They're like the marks for the spiritual scam that is like these parasites. I've experienced it myself by taking Alistair Crowley's book out in public. Like I attracted the vibration that was associated with that book and homeless schizophrenic type person, I don't know, I'm not judging them, I don't have any ill feelings about them, but that's the best way I could describe them. They looked homeless. They kind of looked disheveled.
They walked into the cafe that I was working in where I happened to have this book and it was too busy of a cafe for me to read, but I've always been obsessed with books, so I just keep a book with me in case I have a moment to read. And that day I happened to bring that book along and this guy walks into the cafe and he opens up a Bible, sits down at the table and puts these little candles on the type that are electronic with the little battery.
He turns these little candles on and he's doing his own little seance right there in the cafe. He wanted to do a wizard war. That was him challenging you? It might have been because I accepted his challenge. I walked over to his table and I said, sir, you need a coffee to be in this realm conducting magic. I didn't say that, but said, you need a coffee to be in this cafe or you need to buy something.
And he's like, I'm going to buy something in a minute. He was offended. But hey, don't get mad at me. You look like a homeless person. We have this problem all the time. You can't just come in here and beat the heat. It's just not the way life works. Sorry, I didn't make it this way. So that was my job, unfortunately, was kicking out homeless people. So he bought a coffee and as he angrily bought a coffee from me, he says to me, you know, I'm the 7th Incarnate or I'm the grandson of Alastair Crowley and the 7th incarnation of, you know, some crazy, aggressive boast that included the name Alastair Crowley and Manson.
And the weird thing is, the book wasn't like, on the shelf. It wasn't on the coffee bar in front of me, it was underneath on a shelf, so it wasn't like, in view. This guy didn't see me reading it when he walked in. He just walked in. The book was under there. And so it was very weird that his angry statement that he made was, I'm the incarnation of Charles Manson and the great grandson of Aleister Crowley, or whatever.
I forget exactly the pronoun he used, but yeah, it was very OD and that kind of stuck with me to this day. Like, these books that Alistair Crowley wrote have like a weird energy, especially the book I had in particular. It's called Book Four. It's all about magic and he talks about sacrificing a child being the most energetic ritual or whatever. And all these Crowley apologists say, oh, no, he's actually talking about masturbation.
He's not actually talking about killing a child, he's talking about that's interesting, I hadn't heard that before. Saying it's like spilling your seed was him saying sacrificing a child. And it is weird because he's a particularly perverted writer. These poetry books, one of them called Snowdrops, which itself sounds like a double entendre for come, but he writes about these really weird pedophilic relationships in that book, like a sailor and a deck boy or whatever they called it back in the day.
Some young girl and an older guy. So he has this perverted poetry. And when I read that book, I didn't buy it, but I knew what it was and I saw it on the bookshelf, so I looked through it. Somebody bought it a few weeks after I looked through it because it was gone, but I looked I probably would have grabbed it if it was a signed copy.
I looked at the poetry and it was so perverted. I was like, wow, I really regret ever interacting with this guy's material after reading this. And it was all around the time when pizzagate had reached like a fever pitch and people were doing like, Save the Children marches and stuff. And it all culminated to Sam and I having that podcast on Tinfoil Hat where he yells at me because he thought I was defending Alastair Crowley after I told him all these evil things I suppose Alistair Crowley could have done because it was allegedly that's one weird thing about him.
I think it goes to show that he was kind of a guy who was protected to some degree because he was involved in espionage and Mi Six, although not on the record, he did allegedly do things that appear to be ordained by the Crown, so to speak. So maybe they had a hand in covering up his crimes. But for the most part, there's no evidence other than his own writings and what other people write about him and what authors have written about him to suggest that he did anything criminal.
He was abusive, sure, but there's no evidence that he did anything criminal. He did get kicked out of Italy and there was rumors that he was doing some satanic rituals with some woman and her children, which, hey, that could be it right there. And I made that point on that podcast. But that is like a shadow looming over me, that interview, because since then, I just haven't really talked much about Crowley.
I did one episode with Cheney because she asked me to specifically talk about Alistair Crowley. And she's awesome. I really appreciate her. She had me on her show back when I didn't even have a podcast yet. So she's awesome. If she asked me to research him again, I'd do it for but I'm not interested in him as much as I used to be because I do feel like his energy, whatever it represents, can lead people into a dark place.
And that might be something that people bring to themselves and manifest themselves, and you could blame them for that, maybe other factors in their life that are to blame for it. But for me, it did feel like the closer I got into that material, the more weird sort of dark tinged things would happen. Why do you think that in particular has so much, I guess, influence still today? People wear shirts and they do the hand signs and they drop the name and maybe this is a subjective statement, but why do you think that Crowley is more popular than, say, like, Blavatsky or any other number of occultists from that time? What is it about Crowley in particular that still resonates? It's just his publicity stunts.
Like he was somebody who believed in no such thing as bad press. That whole motto. He reveled in being seen as the biggest baddest man in the world and Wickedest, evil, whatever he wanted to call himself. Maybe that played into his cover. And a lot of what it seems like he was doing, if you read Richard Spence's work, is it seems like he was going into secret societies that were prevalent at the time and sort of busting them up from the inside just by being an asshole and just having like a really brash and kind of self centered, narcissistic personality.
He had his positive aspects, but he had a lot of flaws that I think outweigh those positive aspects. And he maybe used that to an edge, like it was his sort of weapon against these secret societies. Because if you look at his track record, like, he goes into, what was it? The Golden Dawn first or the Order of Thalema. I think that was what he started. The Order of Thalima eventually became that, but there were two groups that he joined and after leaving those groups, he was either the leader or had a fight with the and like, I think both of them ended up kind of failing and kind of becoming something else.
So I wonder to myself, it seems like Spence implies this too, with his research. It's like maybe there was a secret agenda to break up these groups because they saw the political power that these groups might pose in rival to what the Crown in England had going on because they were very much trying to get their control over America and all the other territories. Still to this day, I think, you know, if not in control of America has some sort of control over American politics.
And I think they use agents like Crowley back then at least, to bust up a lot of these secret societies. So to answer your question more accurately, pop culture made Crowley who he is after his mean before he died. I don't think he was even really that well known outside of the weird community of people who are interested in this, kind of know. He had letters in correspondence with Parsons and other people like that, but as far as I know, he was like a drug addicted old man and died kind of miserably.
But because of that publicity stunt streak that he had, I think the rock and roll hippie movement kind of latched on to that because it was counterculture. His ideas represented a lot of what they felt in the counterculture. And you see him in the Beatles album, you see him in Ozzy Osborne's song, you see Led Zeppelin's guitarist Jimmy Page obsessed with him to the point of buying his former residence and kind of spiraling into the really weird place in his life.
I mean, you look at what his band members said about him at that period in his life and it seemed like they even didn't really understand what was going on with him. So, yeah, there is the power that pulls people in with Crowley and I mean, maybe that's because he was particularly interested in being this child of the new Aeon. And in order to do that, he had to interact with these devilish negative spirits and make those bargains where, yeah, we'll make you famous, we'll make you powerful, but there's going to be a risk to this reward we're giving you or there's going to be a consequence to this benefit you're getting.
And that's like the classic thing the jazz players said around that time, too. Like, oh, you go down on the crossroads and you make a deal with the devil. That old Southern tale, right? That's something that people even talk about to this day, people going down. Well, even now when someone gets popular and they get like a Billboard top hit, the Automatic is like, oh, I wonder what family member they had to sacrifice in order to get that number one hit.
I feel like it still happens today. I think that's more to the point of your earlier question about why is crowley more well known over like Blavatsky and these other people. It's because I think culture just moves on and there's these trends that go on and people forget like, I wonder in 50 years if people are going to look back and be like, oh, remember when people did social media and had phones in their pockets? I mean, how crazy was that? Meanwhile, we're here in 2020 something, and in the 18 hundreds, people were doing seances.
That was a popular thing to do on a Friday night. Go to a seance and maybe talk to some spirits, get some insight from a dead famous person. Like we're going to channel the mind of freaking what's his name over in Russia. The guy who had Putin. Yeah, Rasputin or like St. Germain or whatever they were advertising and a lot of that stuff that in the they looked at it as silly and fake and snake oil salesmen.
And that's a big reason how the holistic medicine got phased out. To answer your other point that was on the list about pharmaceutical companies suppressing holistic or natural cures. They lumped all that stuff together as like folklore and Hocom and pseudo witchcraft type BS. And that's a big reason why we're in this chemically induced society now where everything's prescription or chemical or warning label and I don't think they would have saw that coming back then.
But to get back to my question about Crowley and my larger points, like secret societies were in vogue at a certain point in this country. So things like getting some sort of upper edge or getting ahead in life, so to speak, you could maybe accomplish that by communicating with some lost relative from beyond who gives you some kernel of wisdom you can use or make a deal with some entity and local elemental spirit or something like that.
I think that was a lot more commonplace and maybe musicians kind of carried that information along as music became more part of the culture and less of a thing that was like commonplace. Music used to be something in the community. There'd be like a guy playing guitar at a bar and everybody went to that bar, they just played the same fucking ten songs or made up a few songs, but people didn't know music for weren't going on tour with huge productions.
It wasn't like a thing where people were like, oh yeah, have you heard of this guy? It was just like, oh, this guy plays guitar. That's nice. That's really interesting because you mentioned earlier when you're talking about Crowley that he really reveled in that narcissism and self promotion and bad press is good press, right? Like all press is good press for him. And I kind of see that resonate with, I guess, Hollywood and rock and rollers like the Beatles famously bigger than Jesus, right? That was a sacrilege thing to say, but it was right on the exact same lines of alastair Crowley calling himself the wickedest man in the world and the great beast because it was this outlandish like how dare know say that they've got this much power and now that's pretty much what being a celebrity is.
It's having the balls to be like I'm the best at this. Um, and I feel like maybe that's that energy, maybe that's the crowlean energy is just being balls out. That's a good literally comparison you make too. I mean, bringing Hollywood into this as I was just thinking like theater kind of played a big role in bringing the occult from that time period into the modern time. Mean people think about trends now and they're instant, right? Everybody knows around the world or around the English speaking world what's trending if they are in touch with it, right? But back then when you had the 1832 antimasonic movement, a lot of the secret societies on the East Coast either disbanded, became public or went underground.
And I started to wonder, and I haven't really ventured into this research much, I start to wonder maybe that instead of just like giving up, they move west. And it seems like secret societies maintain popularity as the frontier went west as this trend may die big time. Not only that, I think that I've been pulling at this thread too, because on the East Coast you had people still go into court up until the 17 hundreds.
I think in the early 18 hundreds was the last trial where a man was put on trial for being a wizard. He was acquitted. But it shows that there was still a legal process in place for prosecuting people that were allegedly dabbling in magic or black arts. Meanwhile, on the West Coast you had Rosicrucianism, which was pretty much as occult as it kind of got at that point.
But they didn't have that same sort know, derogatory relationship to know devil worshippers or evil or burn them at the stake. And I think there was a huge difference between the West Coast and the East Coast and the West Coast kind of flourished and we still see that today and a completely different vibe and mentality because of that. Right, well, and people forget too, like how closely connected the East Coast was to Europe, whereas the Midwest and the west became really the America that we know today and contributed more so in some ways to what America is now.
But yeah, the further you went west back then, the wilder and more outlaw it was. And I think a lot of those secret groups that dabbled or frequently utilized occult ritual activity to their benefit went west. I mean, you see the Rosicrucians and Bohemian Grove and all these other things that are out there that even to this day are still maintaining some membership. I don't know what their activities are, but I wonder because to bring this back, to know how much of the Crowley popularity was also due in part to his interest in the West Coast because he traveled to California.
He was in California around that time that Hollywood was kind of beginning when a lot of the theater acts became like movie studios. Like, that kind of that was also before actors were necessarily celebrities too. Just kind of like what you were mentioning with the musicians. There weren't necessarily these huge blockbuster celebrities up until around that time. And I think that's that and that's kind of where I was angling.
This whole point to is and I'm glad you said that, you took the words right out of my mouth this sort of cult activity centered around idol worship in many ways. And maybe in the past it was like Dionysus or Artemis or whatever. There's dozens of entities you can pick from from either Greek, Roman or whatever pantheon. But I think they realized the power of that and said, let's make money by creating this with a person.
You see that with Elvis. You see that with the Beatles. You see that with Marilyn Manson. Or not Marilyn Manson. Marilyn Monroe. Well, you kind of kind of with both. I mean, he's also a celebrity, right? But that's decades later. I'm talking about the first generation of stars, right? And I wonder how much of that was particularly geared in these small communities at first. Like, you had maybe like local stars that were like theater acts or small time musicians.
That it's funny that we even still call it stars. Like you yourself are saying stars. And that's exactly what Alistair Crowley used to refer to people that were kind of know, doing as they will, is that they were stars. See, I think that's where we get a lot of our terms from that time period. I'm sort of in a spot with all of that where it seems like there's something darker there.
I just haven't quite figured it out. I mean, the obvious may be like, oh, they're channeling demons or these aliens or whatever, but it definitely feels like there's something to this occult activity. Maybe it's an aggregore or a hive mind or just something to it that I think they've geared towards the rest of us on a mass scale. I think Michael Hoffman talks about it in Secret Societies and Psychological Warfare.
I'm just not thinking of the right term right now. But it's like a hypnosis that they've put on a lot of people. And that's part of what the awakening is that we talked about the beginning with the whole podcast suppression topic. People are waking up because they're like, oh, yeah, the news TV that's all corporate sponsored. Like, I want something real. I want something authentic. And that's why you see Joe Rogan as one of the most popular entertainment content type of thing out there because he's just himself in many ways.
You might not like everything he's interested in, but for the most part he's just doing Joe and that's why it is titled the way it is. I think people really are into that. Maybe that's part of that same mentality of like now everybody can be a star and that's why they love a show like that. Because they're like oh, I feel like I'm friends with this really famous guy because I listen to him 8 hours a week and I know everything he knows.
And now I like eating elk and I like bow and arrow. It has that kind of like even with our podcast we have people who hit us up. They're like dude, I love that one episode. You know, if we were to hang out, we would smoke weed. And it's like I so love when people say all that, but it's like hey man, I don't know you from Adam.
Yeah, sure, we have a lot in common. But podcasting has that effect where you kind of really get close to people. And I know I'm going all over the place here, but I think that's kind of something they're using against us. And there's benefits. There's definitely upsides to what we're going through. I think the awakening is like a self correction because nature has these self corrections inherent to it.
Like these self correcting gears. Like when something gets out of balance, this other equal and opposite force comes in and balances it. I really believe in that very karmic, I got to ask you again, we're not going back into the fullest of questions, but zero to ten Joe Rogan sold some part of his soul to a demon in order to get to where he is. Well, I have to say zero on that one just because I'm connected to Sam and you're not allowed to even say one.
I respect Sam so much that I just wouldn't want to talk about his friend, like personally. You know, I've had my ups and downs with Rogan. Like I wouldn't know who Sam was if it wasn't for Joe Rogan's show. Because once I found out who Joe Rogan was, I started listening to all these other comedy podcasts and that's how I eventually found Tinfoil Hat. Was that when you first started eating elk too? He wasn't into that yet.
It's funny, I liked a lot of Joe Rogan's opinions back then and I did listen kind of like just as background noise while I was gaming. I mean this was like when I was in my early twenty s. I would just smoke weed and game and I'm like this is boring. I got to listen to something while I'm gaming because what am I doing here? I'm just wasting time.
So I started listening to that. But no, I think know it's interesting. Sam made a really good point while we were at his show the other night in the green room, he was talking, eddie Bravo was there. So naturally Joe Rogan came up. I forget how, but. Sam made a really good point. Joe's really good at disclosing information that he doesn't necessarily believe. So he'll put something out there on his podcast and say, like, oh, but that's crazy.
That's ridiculous. But his show's so big that it's kind of like a soft disclosure. Like, if he came out like Alex Jones and was like, the aliens, the reptilians they're going to kill, like, people would be like, no, that's stupid. He's obviously that Alex Jones impression is way better than I was expecting it to be, by the way. Way better. I'm not bad at impressions. I did that black voice earlier or that Southern voice earlier, but whatever.
Can we do a black Alex Jones? No, I'm just kidding. AI is going to have to come up with we could probably do that. We could just blend it in. We'll take like, little boozy and Alex Jones and just train it on the both of them. But I think Joe has that ability where he could bring up something know, maybe you don't necessarily have that same result that you get with Jones where people are a little more skeptical or off put by his delivery.
With Joe, he can be like, no, that's crazy. But tell me more. The straight man. It's the same. Like, if you're doing a comedy, right, you have to have the straight man that reacts to all the comedic stuff. Otherwise, nothing really makes any sense. That's the person that needs that structure, right? That's the mark. Well, that's me. That's how I felt on Illuminati, confirmed sometimes when Chris and Juan would tee off on me.
Really? So you felt like the straight man sometimes on a what's an outlandish theory that a lot of people bring up and you can't say flat earth because you already said it, that a lot of people bring up and you're just, ah, not this freaking topic again. Well, I do love Tartaria for many reasons because it kind of got me a bug in me to look into my own local area.
But I do get a little bit triggered when I hear people make some statements within that realm. And I don't want to get too specific because, again, there are some aspects to the whole theory concept that I think are interesting and worthwhile. But there is a lot of people who now have these Instagram accounts where all they do is show you a picture of a building and say, there's no way we could have built this in 1850.
There's no way we could have built this in 17 whatever before there were like, human rights violations or any sort of workman's comp. Yeah. And I look around, I'm like, dude, I live in a town that's 400 years old. It's almost 400 years old. It's literally on the shore. Is one of the first or was it already there when the explorers showed up and they just moved in and said they made it that's the thing that could be true.
Sure. And that's a big thing that people say, and I don't particularly know either way, but I think it's just too convenient. I can go into my Milford library here in the town of Milford that was founded in 1636, and I could find literally a list of every single person that's lived or owned property in this town since it was founded. Right. I think that means something. It might not mean that everything we're told is exactly how it is, but I don't necessarily think that the people who said they built this were lying to cover up the fact that they maraudered it.
That could be the case with certain structures like down in, what is it called? Fort Jefferson in the dry Tortugas. That's an interesting wonder. You know, maybe that was built much earlier and the United States just kind of claimed it. But when it comes know, buildings like around here where I live, it seems pretty obvious like that they were there when they said they built them and not previous to that.
But why I get a little bit triggered, I guess is more because when I started looking into it I found out that there are actually evidence. There is evidence of other cultures, let's say beyond the British, the French, the Dutch, the Spanish and the Native Americans that had an impact here on the East Coast before Columbus. And even the Native Americans whose history has been so just massacred, chopped to pieces and thrown by the wayside.
I mean, literally there's been a genocide on these people. They've been removed from their land and put in poverty. And sure some of them are doing all right now, but I'm sure they would like to have their land that they have. How do you think they felt on 911? What do you think the general consent? Do you think there was a big wave of patriotism within the reservation communities? I can't speak for Native Americans, I just wouldn't want to.
Not that I'm some kind of like bleeding heart liberal, but I do think that they're particularly skeptical of anything the government does and with good reason. So I wouldn't be surprised if they immediately recognize the false flag. And unfortunately, I've heard from natives themselves that there are a lot of Native Americans that kind of are blue pilled, so to speak, or know they've been born into this situation where it's better to get along than go against it.
Right. It did seem like Bernie Sanders had a certain demographic locked compared to at least the opponents when it came to that for I mean, I'm sure Native Americans there's plenty of support for know, I don't know much. There might be a bunch of Native American Trump supporters out there who would agree. I would suspect that more than anything. But I don't know. Yeah, because I've seen tons of Native Americans who just have Trump flags there are certain Native American communities near me, and you could tell sometimes I'm a Native bumper sticker and they'll have, like, a Trump bumper sticker next to so I've seen that for sure.
But then again, interesting dynamic to me, man. I think it's uniquely American. Not in a good or a bad way, but just I'm sure Australia has aboriginals and stuff, but I feel like within America, us being so damn new. And also, like you were mentioning before, right after 911, people got this patriotism thing, but then you also mentioned there was this aspect of, like, I don't trust those brown people, you know what I mean? But in America, it's so interesting because you could be like, I don't trust that guy over there, and the guy over there could be American.
You know, like, respond in, like, a New York accent, and you'd be, you know, you get the pass, and then you move on to the next one. And it's interesting because up until this last century, being a nationalist almost meant that you could visually decide if someone was part of your nation or not. And now specifically in America, that all completely goes away. And now there's all these other cues.
They're like cultural cues that determine whether or not you're part of this nation. I don't know. I find that beyond fascinating. Yeah, when I was a kid, I remember seeing shirts and bumper stickers that said stuff like, oh, you're worried about the illegal immigrants while we were here. First they would have, like, pictures, native Americans holding rifles and stuff. And I always liked that kind of stuff because I'm like, yeah, they're right.
What the hell? I don't know. I've always kind of been anticolonialistic in that sense. But, hey, then again, my whole life is predicated on colonialism. I think every American's life is predicated on colonialism in some way because a lot of our resources, whether we realize it or not, come from Third World countries where aspects of colonialism are still alive today. Right? I mean, people who are being basically taken advantage of for their resource wealth, and it's just a sad situation around the world.
So I have a lot of empathy for the Native Americans and the indigenous people around the world. And I kind of forget what question led us here, but I know I don't have that much more time. I asked you to justify why you were delivering pastries to war criminals, and you just kind of kept detracting and going on tangents, and that's how we ended up rewind the tape.
But I want to mean we could go on for another couple hours. I wanted to get into Bob Marley in particular because that's a fascinating one, but we're going to save that one for next time. And I also don't mean to drop, like, a huge bomb right at the end of this. This one could blow it wide open. We could go for another hour. But I have to know, do you believe in dinosaurs? Well, it's interesting because the same yeah, I don't I believe less and less in dinosaurs.
The more I learn about these guys that studied dinosaurs in the 18 hundreds, it seems like they are all in cahoots with the same people that own the oil company. And I wonder own the oil companies. I wonder if they were in some kind of plan to give people this different notion of the earth and convert people to this more atheistic mindset, to make people more subservient and less.
Because if somebody believes in God, then they can have no master other than God, right? So I think they started to create these narratives that went against the Bible. And I used to not believe in this stuff for a long time. When I was raised Catholic, I totally was like, no, this is all crap. Like, I'm an atheist. I don't believe in that. I like science. I've really gone.
Do you believe in dinosaurs at that time too? Yeah, obviously. I didn't really even think it was a question. But now I think about it, I'm like, well, these bones that they pull out of the ground, maybe they're found in ways that look like certain creatures. And the way we are told, oh, this was a delililapodidosaurus, or this is a branchosaurus. Or maybe that's just all sort of a reconstruction of the truth.
And it's closer to the truth that there were dragons and there were other types of maybe what we would consider more mythical beings, as the Bible describes, right, where there was all this genetic manipulation going on and people were creating like chimeras and half man, half horse and all this other weird stuff. I mean, who knows? Maybe that's what it is. And it's like they don't want us to know about the time before the flood when there are all these weird creatures.
Because when you look at like I don't know how accurate this is, but there's a stone carving in Thailand or Indonesia. I'm not sure exactly where this giant Angkor Wat is. It might be in Thailand, but there's a relief in Angkor watt of a man on what looks like a stegosaurus and he's riding the back of a stegosaurus of all animals. I mean, a stegosaurus has like, plates, spiny plates on its back.
So I don't know how that works. He was like a prehistoric Gigi Allen or something. Maybe he was like a prehistoric, I don't know, Napoleon on his horse and stegosaurus instead. I don't mean the Carthaginians rode elephants, right? The war elephants. But elephants don't have spiny plates protruding from their back, so it poses a different set of problems. But it's like the club. It's like the antitheft device.
Like you can't steal someone's stegosaurus because you don't know the perfect place to sit. Well, in South America too, there's stories of people flying with pterodactyls, like using pterodactyls as early form of travel. Same way you would pull a horse, would pull a cart. These pterodactyls would pull people on these rigs that they would strap to them. So I don't know how true that is. That could just be some sort of dream somebody wrote up in the 18 hundreds and purported it as a real story.
But I think there's a lot of evidence to suggest that what we think of dinosaurs now is not true. And I just call into question the scientific timeline. I think the biblical timeline has more interesting aspects to it, and curiously, they seem to line up with some things that we find around the world. But then again, I don't know. I have talked to a lot of Christians in the past few months, so I could have just kind of been biased a little bit by their perspectives.
I haven't looked that far into it. But there is this thing that anybody who's interested in the dinosaurs, whether they're real or not, should look up. And it's called the Bone Wars. And it comprised of two gentlemen who were friends that basically fought each other to compete to see who can discover more dinosaurs. And it seems like they just took one type of creature and gave it, like, 700 different names and moved a bone over here and said, oh, well, this is a Tyrannosaurus rex.
0. This is a Tyrannosaurus rex. 2. I think they were just doing that kind of science, foolery. They were like, mashing the AI generate button, right? And like, oh, I'm going to call this one of this. Yeah, well, it seems like, yeah, they were just, like, playing with Legos when they came with these dinosaur bones. Who knows? Maybe better analogy. Yeah, maybe the dinosaur bones were actually giant skeletons that were supposed to be in man form.
You take, like, six of them and rearrange them, and you can make, like, a Tyrannosaurus rex. I mean, who knows? They could have been like, hey, we have all these stupid giant bones that we don't want anybody to know the truth about. Let's just rearrange them and put them on display. We can carve them. We can shape them. I mean, half of the dinosaurs you see in the museum, they say it's just plaster cast.
It's not actually the real. So this is like the Smithsonian is basically like Taco Bell. They've got five ingredients, and they just rearrange them in, like, 80 different ways. Like Taco Bell. That's the best metaphor we could have for this. It's like five ingredients and they just rearrange it. A chalupa, a burrito, a taco. It's all the same thing and just a different presentation. I think that's a good place to end this.
And we covered good ground today. I mean, we did dinosaurs and Crowley and flat earth and mud flood and all kinds of stuff. Man, I would go longer if I didn't have, unfortunately, another podcast scheduled. But yeah, this is really fun, dude. Anytime we'll have a part two, we'll have a part two because these first ones are mainly interviews. And then when we talk again, we can go deep on some specific topics and stuff and there's not going to be any sort of end to where we could end up going.
So I'm looking forward to it, man. So tell people one more time where to find you, where your podcast is at, and what you got going on. So Myfamilythinksomcrazy. com is the best place to start. If you want to just search the name of the show. Wherever you already listen to podcasts, that's a great way to do it. You could support us on Patreon Rock. Finn substack. That's where you get the show early and you get bonus content, but you can find the show really anywhere.
You listen to podcasts and if you don't find it on the podcast, you listen to it. Listen to shows on. Just email me mfticpodcast@gmail. com and if you have your own podcast, check me out altmediaunited. com and email me. Like I said earlier, altmediaunited@gmail. com and we can get you on the website. So long as you have a podcast and you're willing to post your stuff on our website, there's no cost to you and it's a great way to network and maybe even grow your show.
Learn from others who are doing it better than you could be. So yeah, I think that's a great place to start. And Paranoid American is on Alt Media United. We still got to get your video feed or RSS feed on there, but either way, brother, this has been fun. Let's do it again. If people have a hankering to hear more conversations with the two of us, they're in luck because you've been on My show like three or four times now.
So just go and start there. If you haven't listened to my show before, go and check out Paranoid American. Just search that in the search bar and you'll find at least four or five episodes where Thomas joins me as a guest. Word up, man. Thank you again for coming. And we're going to have many more of these to come. And an extra special shout out to Sam Tripoli.
Thank you for employing and creating jobs in this conspiracy theory world. That's actually one of the coolest things possible. Who knew that doing all this research into conspiracies and alternative history would actually amount to anything? That's the biggest thing people should take? Well, who knew that you could become a professional video game player when we were younger too, right? Like, the parents would be like, you need to go get a job.
And little did they know, if you just would have stuck with that, you could become a millionaire twitch streamer. So parents don't know what the hell they're talking about. So anyways, yeah, don't do what your parents tell you. And tonight I want everyone listening to go out and steal one thing from Target and send it to Mark because he's the real brains behind this operation. Yeah. Give me Marvel, Legends, Omega Kid or Fang, because I don't have them yet.
I'm trying to build. All right, y'all, I'm going to give you, like, a five second lead. Start if you need to just tap the volume down the slightest. I swear that this commercial isn't too loud, but it is a little loud, so here you go. Thanks again. They said it was forbidden. They said it was dangerous. They were right. Introducing the paranoid American Homunculus owner's manual. Dive into the arcane, into the hidden corners of the occult.
This isn't just a comic. It's a hidden tome of supernatural power. All original artwork illustrating the groundbreaking research of Juan Ayala, one of the only living homunculogists of our time. Learn how to summon your own homunculus. An enigma wrapped in the fabric of reality itself. Their power at your fingertips. Their existence, your secret. Explore the mysteries of the Aristotelian, the spiritual, the paracelcian, the crowlean homunculus. Ancient knowledge lost to time, now unearthed in this forbidden tale.
This comic book holds truths not meant for the light of day. Knowledge that was buried, feared and shunned. Are you ready to uncover the hidden? The paranoid American homunculus owner's manual. Not for the faint of heart. Available now from paranoid American. Get your copy@tjojp. com or paranoidamerican. com today. .
